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"3rd Debate" Thread


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3 hours ago, vcczar said:

Since I saw the quote, I saw what @PoliticalPundit I said. There is no user on this forum more biased than this person. Almost everything he says is in bad faith or antagonistic. This is why I blocked him. I wish I had quotes from him blocked. It would make life much more enjoyable on this forum, since I don’t like people that are a waste of my time. @admin_270 is there any way to block quotes from @PoliticalPundit when other people quote him. I want to go on this forum as if this person doesn’t exist. I don’t like anything about him. Personally or ideologically. I’d say intellectually, but that wouldn’t apply to him.   Can I erase him completely from any post I see? I don’t want to go on any further tirades, but I can’t stand this user. I’ve blocked him so I don’t violate your rules @admin_270 but I will freely violate them out of principle if I keep seeing them. I don’t see the point of blocking people when I keep seeing the person’s posts via quotes!

This is an extended personal attack - please be more careful in the future.

It would be great for the block feature to allow for also blocking quotes or blocked users as well as the blocked users' posts, but I do not believe this can be done currently.

Best suggestion I can give is ignore his quotes.

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Something I've noticed - neither of them are particularly good at contextualizing. They both tend to make references to things without really explaining what they're talking about, in a way that may m

Yeah your rose colored glasses are showing. Dont think I didnt notice how you went completely silent while Bidens dominant streak during the health care portion was happening. 

Yes she definitively was a good moderator, she was very neutral and gave them a good time to reply.

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My only concern re: Trump is the obvious. What if it was too late?

 

He just gave the debate of his political career and yet it might not have even mattered bc of early voting. How many people do you think are regretting their Biden vote they mailed in too early? It could be 5% of the mail in, could be 15%.. we'll never know.

 

Now the only thing we have to look at is rallies (or the lack thereof from Biden) and any recent polls that show trends. 

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1 hour ago, PoliticalPundit said:

My only concern re: Trump is the obvious. What if it was too late?

 

He just gave the debate of his political career and yet it might not have even mattered bc of early voting. How many people do you think are regretting their Biden vote they mailed in too early? It could be 5% of the mail in, could be 15%.. we'll never know.

 

Now the only thing we have to look at is rallies (or the lack thereof from Biden) and any recent polls that show trends. 

Probably none?

If people voted early, they presumably did so because they had already made up their minds.

Trump could give the greatest debate in world history, but it would not erase his performance as President of the United States for the past four years.  

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10 hours ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

Why hasn't Trump brought up you ain't black? Poor kids are as talented as white kids? Racial jungle? Obama is the first articulate black guy? Unlike the African Americans Hispanics are diverse etc? All free bait.

 

10 hours ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

Even the "you can't go into a 7/11 without an Indian accent?" Hed at least even this segment if not win it.

Yeah that exposes the sooo overly considerate, emphatic, warmhearted and uniting Biden well... a show, nothing else.

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10 hours ago, Reagan04 said:

Joe is racking up points during the back half here, especially with that ending line about the separated kids.

So why couldn't he answer properly the ''Who built the cages?'' question? That's the emphatic candidate some praise...

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No surprise actually, Trump won that clearly. Biden had weak responses and couldn't deliver his main arguments probably. For example, who are the poor boys?
Anyway, Trump was very presidential and controlled. I don't know if he had been switched by aliens or something like that. It was good to see him that way, but he still is no Mike Pence clearly. Pence's decency, control, calmness and intelligence might be unmatched in today's circus of politics. 
 
Where did Biden lose?
 
Biden says Trump lacks a plan while also saying he will encourage people wearing masks. The people who don't want to wear one won't wear a mask under a Biden administration either. That's no plan at all, not to mention the H1N1 handling...
 
Biden says he's ending the pandemic. That's laughable I mean no country (of the size of the US) can end that pandemic immediately.
Criticizing Trump for not wanting Americans to panic is completely wrong. Had he told the people about how serious the disease is, Democrats would have called Trump a fearmonger who wants to get votes... Biden's catchphrase is Hope over Fear. That's telling a lot here. Biden would have said nothing about seriousness like he criticized the travel ban.
 
At one time Biden was asked if he wants to respond by the moderator. He said no. That's weak and he knows Trump was right.
Biden praising Cuomo is unbelievable. Cuomo's response was one of the worst and even CNN knows that.
Biden says Iran will pay a price for meddling into the election (to his advantage probably). What price will it be? A renewal of the catastrophic Iran nuclear deal built under his Vice Presidency???
 
Biden's hypocrisy was exposed several times. Fracking, WHO BUILT THE CAGES? and when asked to speak to the people affected by his crime bill, he avoided the possibility to be so overly emphatic when talking to the people and ignored them (for what reason? Well, I know, but that doesn't matter to the lame media of course.)
Trump won the arguments on Wall Street, Biden's business dealings and corruption clearly.
I'd say was at Trump A-, Biden C-/D+ I don't know. I can't see any argument why Biden did better than Trump.

 

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2 minutes ago, Conservative Elector 2 said:
No surprise actually, Trump won that clearly. Biden had weak responses and couldn't deliver his main arguments probably. For example, who are the poor boys?
Anyway, Trump was very presidential and controlled. I don't know if he had been switched by aliens or something like that. It was good to see him that way, but he still is no Mike Pence clearly. Pence's decency, control, calmness and intelligence might be unmatched in today's circus of politics. 
 
Where did Biden lose?
 
Biden says Trump lacks a plan while also saying he will encourage people wearing masks. The people who don't want to wear one won't wear a mask under a Biden administration either. That's no plan at all, not to mention the H1N1 handling...
 
Biden says he's ending the pandemic. That's laughable I mean no country (of the size of the US) can end that pandemic immediately.
Criticizing Trump for not wanting Americans to panic is completely wrong. Had he told the people about how serious the disease is, Democrats would have called Trump a fearmonger who wants to get votes... Biden's catchphrase is Hope over Fear. That's telling a lot here. Biden would have said nothing about seriousness like he criticized the travel ban.
 
At one time Biden was asked if he wants to respond by the moderator. He said no. That's weak and he knows Trump was right.
Biden praising Cuomo is unbelievable. Cuomo's response was one of the worst and even CNN knows that.
Biden says Iran will pay a price for meddling into the election (to his advantage probably). What price will it be? A renewal of the catastrophic Iran nuclear deal built under his Vice Presidency???
 
Biden's hypocrisy was exposed several times. Fracking, WHO BUILT THE CAGES? and when asked to speak to the people affected by his crime bill, he avoided the possibility to be so overly emphatic when talking to the people and ignored them (for what reason? Well, I know, but that doesn't matter to the lame media of course.)
Trump won the arguments on Wall Street, Biden's business dealings and corruption clearly.
I'd say was at Trump A-, Biden C-/D+ I don't know. I can't see any argument why Biden did better than Trump.

 

Again, if you cant see any argument youre too biased to have a good discussion about it.

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3 hours ago, Actinguy said:

Probably none?

If people voted early, they presumably did so because they had already made up their minds.

Trump could give the greatest debate in world history, but it would not erase his performance as President of the United States for the past four years.  

As you point out, it could be too late. This article suggests Democrats are already succeeding. I love POLITICO. It might be my favorite source right now lol.

https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/10/23/early-voting-numbers-swing-states-431363

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Just now, Hestia11 said:

Again, if you cant see any argument youre too biased to have a good discussion about it.

I feel like this should also be used for all the people who just hate Trump. There are people all over the political spectrum who are too biased to have good honest discussion unfortunately.

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1 minute ago, SilentLiberty said:

I feel like this should also be used for all the people who just hate Trump. There are people all over the political spectrum who are too biased to have good honest discussion unfortunately.

Sure. I think you can make an argument that either person won, so I was attributing it to this specific instance.

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I know Daily Kos isn't a neutral source, but this article documents four insta-polls showing Biden the winner by about 10-15 points:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/10/22/1988826/-Biden-Wins-Instant-Debate-Poll-52-to-39-Improves-Favorable-Rating-by-3

Maybe there are also insta-polls showing Trump as the winner, I don't know. And it's possible that there were just more Biden supporters tuned in than Trump supporters.

Honestly, I wasn't super-impressed with either of them. Trump improved over his performance in the last debate simply by being less obnoxious, but there's really nothing he could say that would win my vote at this point and I'm not inclined to trust that what he says is true unless it's been verified independently. Biden wasn't at his sharpest and, as I mentioned before, sometimes failed to contextualize what he was talking about, but was at least more truthful and had a reasonably strong closing statement. However, I don't think Trump landed any kind of big knockout punch that's going to change the direction of the campaign all by itself.

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1 minute ago, RI Democrat said:

I know Daily Kos isn't a neutral source, but this article documents four insta-polls showing Biden the winner by about 10-15 points:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/10/22/1988826/-Biden-Wins-Instant-Debate-Poll-52-to-39-Improves-Favorable-Rating-by-3

Maybe there are also insta-polls showing Trump as the winner, I don't know. And it's possible that there were just more Biden supporters tuned in than Trump supporters.

Honestly, I wasn't super-impressed with either of them. Trump improved over his performance in the last debate simply by being less obnoxious, but there's really nothing he could say that would win my vote at this point and I'm not inclined to trust that what he says is true unless it's been verified independently. Biden wasn't at his sharpest and, as I mentioned before, sometimes failed to contextualize what he was talking about, but was at least more truthful and had a reasonably strong closing statement. However, I don't think Trump landed any kind of big knockout punch that's going to change the direction of the campaign all by itself.

Trump tweeted out like 4 or 5 screenshots of Twitter polls last night where he was selected as the debate winner. Of course the same issues you talked about for Biden's victory polls are similar and potential issues for Trump's victory polls.

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After sleeping on it, they're even. Trump edged out a little bit because of Bidens statements on energy, which hurts him in PA and TX especially. Trump needs to make ads for them and blast them in the rust belt. I guarantee it'd make people last-minute switch for Trump as the "safe choice" for their jobs.

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4 minutes ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

After sleeping on it, they're even. Trump edged out a little bit because of Bidens statements on energy, which hurts him in PA and TX especially. Trump needs to make ads for them and blast them in the rust belt. I guarantee it'd make people last-minute switch for Trump as the "safe choice" for their jobs.

The problem is...does the Trump campaign have the cash for that? They're getting swamped right now.

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2 minutes ago, Hestia11 said:

The problem is...does the Trump campaign have the cash for that? They're getting swamped right now.

FEC says they have like 60 or 80 mil cash on hand or something. Should be enoughm

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I know oil is big in Texas, but is it really that big in Pennsylvania - are there a bunch of fracking jobs there or something?

Saying that we're going to transition away from oil really shouldn't be controversial at this point - we have to do it if we're going to avoid catastrophic climate change. Maybe some jobs will be lost in the process but a lot of new ones will be created as we bring in more renewables. As long as there are transition/retraining programs in place for oil industry workers, this shouldn't be a huge political alarm bell.

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59 minutes ago, Hestia11 said:

Again, if you cant see any argument youre too biased to have a good discussion about it.

It doesn't mean necessarily that there isn't any argument. I just can't think of any besides ''orange man bad''. 

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2 minutes ago, RI Democrat said:

I know oil is big in Texas, but is it really that big in Pennsylvania - are there a bunch of fracking jobs there or something?

Saying that we're going to transition away from oil really shouldn't be controversial at this point - we have to do it if we're going to avoid catastrophic climate change. Maybe some jobs will be lost in the process but a lot of new ones will be created as we bring in more renewables. As long as there are transition/retraining programs in place for oil industry workers, this shouldn't be a huge political alarm bell.

Coal and oil are important industries in many states. As automation is taking jobs, its going to be difficult to produce enough jobs to compensate for those lost in the transition. I support environmentalism, but If I had to choose between helping the environment or having a job I would choose the job.

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3 minutes ago, Conservative Elector 2 said:

It doesn't mean necessarily that there isn't any argument. I just can't think of any besides ''orange man bad''. 

Really?

What about the health care portion, where Biden stood up for Obamacare and Trump couldn't reference a single thing about the plan that he was supposedly crafting. Or the part about children being thrown in cages (even though Trump did point out who built those cages), what about the person that filled them? Or about coronavirus, when he seemed to brush off 220 thousand dead Americans. Or about how to unify the country, where Trump didn't even try to answer the question. Or when Trump attempted to claim he was the "least racist person in the room" to a black moderator? 

You're biased. You "can't think of any"? Then you either didn't watch the debate or you're just not trying.

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10 minutes ago, Conservative Elector 2 said:

It doesn't mean necessarily that there isn't any argument. I just can't think of any besides ''orange man bad''. 

 

9 minutes ago, Hestia11 said:

Really?

What about the health care portion, where Biden stood up for Obamacare and Trump couldn't reference a single thing about the plan that he was supposedly crafting. Or the part about children being thrown in cages (even though Trump did point out who built those cages), what about the person that filled them? Or about coronavirus, when he seemed to brush off 220 thousand dead Americans. Or about how to unify the country, where Trump didn't even try to answer the question. Or when Trump attempted to claim he was the "least racist person in the room" to a black moderator? 

You're biased. You "can't think of any"? Then you either didn't watch the debate or you're just not trying.

Look, can we all agree that the real winner was the moderator?

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4 minutes ago, Zenobiyl said:

 

Look, can we all agree that the real winner was the moderator?

She was great!

13 minutes ago, Hestia11 said:

What about the health care portion, where Biden stood up for Obamacare and Trump couldn't reference a single thing about the plan that he was supposedly crafting. Or the part about children being thrown in cages (even though Trump did point out who built those cages), what about the person that filled them? Or about coronavirus, when he seemed to brush off 220 thousand dead Americans. Or about how to unify the country, where Trump didn't even try to answer the question. Or when Trump attempted to claim he was the "least racist person in the room" to a black moderator?

I think Trump explained why his healthcare plan is better than Joe's.

The bold part is the reason why he won that argument.

I explained why I think Trump also won on the Corona issue. Who was against the travel ban? Who says hope over fear, but criticize Trump for giving Americans hope instead of fear actually? Who has no plan but to encouraging to wear a mask (people won't do it under Biden if they don't do under Trump)?

The ''racist in the room'' issue wasn't one to win or lose. It was typical Trump rhetoric, nothing memorable good or bad here.

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5 minutes ago, Conservative Elector 2 said:

She was great!

I think Trump explained why his healthcare plan is better than Joe's.

The bold part is the reason why he won that argument.

I explained why I think Trump also won on the Corona issue. Who was against the travel ban? Who says hope over fear, but criticize Trump for giving Americans hope instead of fear actually? Who has no plan but to encouraging to wear a mask (people won't do it under Biden if they don't do under Trump)?

The ''racist in the room'' issue wasn't one to win or lose. It was typical Trump rhetoric, nothing memorable good or bad here.

You think. However, you said that there was "no way anyone could think Joe won". There are certainly ways, and the fact that you don't think so is simply biased thinking. 

He explained testing and tracing, which is an abysmal failure in the US right now, by the way. I'm sorry that hope coming from a government that has done absolutely nothing to help the American people in this crisis isn't exactly trusted. I still remember when they sent California broken ventilators. I still remember when they made states bid against each other for PPE. And I certainly remember the 20 deaths a day in my state right now. If the federal government stepped in to cajole these states into line, and helped in the testing regime, maybe midwestern states wouldn't be averaging a 20% positivity rate. 

What about Biden's line that your dog whistle is as big as a fog horn? I think that was a perfectly good line. 

I can see how people thought Trump won. However, saying that there is no way for people to think Biden won besides "orange man bad" is a sign of your bias.

 

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34 minutes ago, RI Democrat said:

I know oil is big in Texas, but is it really that big in Pennsylvania - are there a bunch of fracking jobs there or something?

Saying that we're going to transition away from oil really shouldn't be controversial at this point - we have to do it if we're going to avoid catastrophic climate change. Maybe some jobs will be lost in the process but a lot of new ones will be created as we bring in more renewables. As long as there are transition/retraining programs in place for oil industry workers, this shouldn't be a huge political alarm bell.

To my knowledge natural oil and transportation industries are HUGE still in the rust belt and would be the first ones affected by energy policy.

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