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Historic Vote #5: Assuming State War Debts


vcczar
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Historic Vote #5: Assuming State War Debts  

21 members have voted

  1. 1. How do you vote to assume state war debts? (see my write-up in the first comment)

  2. 2. Which kind of Senator would you be? Note: only including those that existed.

    • A Pro-Administrative Northerner, supportive of the bill because it helps strengthen the new government and will bolster US trade, industries, and finance.
    • A Pro-Administrative Southerner, supportive of the bill as it will bolster US trade, industries, and finance but mildly concerned of a strengthening central government.
    • Anti-Administrative Senator generally opposed to the Washington/Hamilton policies, but convinced by Madison and his Compromise to support at least this one Hamilton bill.
    • Anti-Administrative Senator opposed to any or all attempts to strengthen the federal government, the banking class, and stockjobbers on Wall Street, etc.
  3. 3. Which leader philosophy do you think you would have migrated to nationally at this time?

    • Hamilton's Federalist designs for a strong industrialized and finance-based nation resembling Great Britain. Strong standing military. Strong central government.
    • Jefferson's Republican designs for a utopian agrarian society led by landed gentry and based on Republican ideals now emerging from France. More Democracy. More States Rights.
    • Madison's Federalized Republicanism blend of 75% Jefferson and 25% Hamilton.
    • Washington's independent blend of 75% Hamilton and 25% Jefferson
    • William Maclay's idealized Revolution-era (the first federally-elected Ron Paul) philosophy of never wanting to increase Federal Power and his nostalgia for the Articles of Confederation.
  4. 4. As a Senator in 1790, where would your focus be?

    • Improving the financial sector (Banks, stock market, etc.)
    • Improving national trade, especially domestic and foreign mercantile, and tariffs.
    • Focusing on Agrarian interests
    • Focused on surveying the West and planning westward expansion for settlement and extracting natural resources.
    • Focused on building a respectable military force -- army and navy.
    • Focused on creating a federal Justice system, including the Court system.
    • Focused on foreign policy
      0
    • Other (mention below)
  5. 5. The capital will be moved to the South (between Virginia and Maryland). How would you have felt (pick closest reaction)?

    • Considering it is in the middle of the Country, I think that's fair.
    • Why move the capital away from our financial and economic centers in NYC, Philadelphia, and Boston?
    • The capital should be in Charleston or Savannah, considering so much of this legislation seems to be favoring Northerners.
      0
    • I think it might be a good idea to continually move the capital to ensure it is always in the middle of the country. As we move West, so should the capital.
    • I don't think it is important where the capital is. I have no real reaction.
    • Other (mention below)


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You are a US Senator in August 1790.

Since Pres. Washington's inauguration, Sec of Treasury Alexander Hamilton has been working on a plan to build the national credit of the new nation and binding the states more closely to the new federal government. Each state had incurred debt as a colony and then as an independent state during the Rebellion. Hamilton's plan was to have the federal government take on all the debt of the states in exchange for government bonds. Released of the debts, the states would also have more revenue to help grow the new nation, while the new nation would have a debt in order to build credit. 

In January, Hamilton had released his economic report, which suggested this action. However, there was a North-South divide on the issue. For the most part, Southerners had already repaid their debts, while the North mostly had not. Washington administration critics, Sec of State Jefferson and Rep. Madison, opposed Hamilton's economic policies. 

In June, Jefferson hosted a dinner attended by Hamilton, Madison and others. At some point, the assumption of debts came up. Madison supposedly brought up a Compromise: He would not block the Assumption Bill in the House and would get enough Southerners to support it if Federalists agreed first to relocate the nation's capital (then in New York City) in a Southern state. 

In July, the Senate and House passed a bill to relocate the capital of the nation from New York City to a new location on the Potomac between Maryland and Virginia after a 10-year temporary capital in Philadelphia, while plans for the new capital city could polished out. This bill received the planned bipartisan support. 

Now it is August, Rep. James Madison, arguably the most active anti-administration figure, is calling on his allies to support the Assumption of Debts, despite concerns that it further centralized the government's strength of the states and likely aids the North more than the South. The Federalists, already aware that building federal credit will allow trade to expand and build the overall national wealth, need no convincing on the matter. 

Sen. Oliver Ellsworth of CT has now proposed the bill. How would you vote?

 

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32 minutes ago, vcczar said:

For the most part, Southerners had already repaid their debts, while the North mostly had not.

 

“A civics lesson from a slaver? Hey, neighbor: your debts are paid cuz you don’t pay for labor.”

I’m a Hamiltonian, through and through. ;c)

 

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1 hour ago, Actinguy said:

“A civics lesson from a slaver? Hey, neighbor: your debts are paid cuz you don’t pay for labor.”

I’m a Hamiltonian, through and through. ;c)

 

Let's show who these Federalists are up against, SOUTHERN MOTHERFUCKING DEMOCRATIC REPUBLICANS!

I'm a Jeffersonian if you couldn't tell 😉 

Though to be fair, moreso a Madisonian when it comes to the factions that arise.

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2 hours ago, Reagan04 said:

Let's show who these Federalists are up against, SOUTHERN MOTHERFUCKING DEMOCRATIC REPUBLICANS!

I'm a Jeffersonian if you couldn't tell 😉 

Though to be fair, moreso a Madisonian when it comes to the factions that arise.

Based

Also was there a stock market back then?

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3 hours ago, Reagan04 said:

Let's show who these Federalists are up against, SOUTHERN MOTHERFUCKING DEMOCRATIC REPUBLICANS!

I'm a Jeffersonian if you couldn't tell 😉 

Though to be fair, moreso a Madisonian when it comes to the factions that arise.

I put Washington because I believe in the Jeffersonian ideal of Democracy, of expanded suffrage, of a government away from the elites, etc. However, I would have opposed the utopian agrarian ideal, social and political influence based on slavery, and the policy of favoring France over England, when the country is so briefly removed from GB that many people still have relatives living in England. I would have been both very pro-industry, mercantile trade, abolition, but also very pro-common man, suffrage, etc. I would probably also favor expansion Westward but only without bloodshed and without one-sided treaties. I'd probably propose that Native Tribes may apply for citizenship as if they were immigrant residents in the country, for part of the trade deal, among other things. I'd be very pro-modernization. I'd probably be a nuisance in the South for advocating that they diversify their industries rather than relying on single cash-crops in states. 

I would probably be a loose cannon on voting. Fortunately, the early party system allowed for more independence than the next party system. I could be a trusted vote for Jefferson and Madison at times. 

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