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Kamala Harris was the worst Choice for Biden.


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Given Biden had painted himself into a very small spot with potential VP nominee picks (must be female, strongly pressured to choose a black, so perhaps 6.5% of U.S. pop. and 1% of Senators, i.e., Harris), I think Harris was the best choice (significant national experience, already run a high profile national campaign - the only black female I can think of off-hand who is active in politics where those 2 apply - Carol Moseley Braun is the only other one I can think of off-hand, and she hasn't been active in politics since 2011).

 

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I agree with @admin_270 that after Biden pledged to choose a woman, Kamala was the best choice.  (There were better men, but there's also something to be said for shattering glass ceilings and whatnot).

I don't buy for a second that black voters...who EXTREMELY supported Biden during the Primaries so much that they almost single handedly carried him to the nomination...suddenly hate him for hiring a black woman.  That's not possible.

#FakeNews

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Yes. Biden completely pigeonholed himself with pledging to take a woman, then in the process of doing so selects one who flamed out before IA and only appeals to one of the least reliable voting groups. If he was going to go the women route Whittmer should have been the pick. Likely wins Michigan and makes a stronger ticket in the Rust Belt (where dems are blowing it again)

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7 hours ago, admin_270 said:

Yes, unlikely many black voters have changed their mind on Biden because of Harris, IMO.

I know a few black men that have a problem with her having a white husband.  That is still largely frowned upon in black culture.

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I personally do believe that Trump will get at least 15% of the black vote in the upcoming election, I have personally seen quite a few come out in support lately.  I do think that the Democrats are in serious danger of losing the election if they do not retain control over this portion of their base.  Needless to say, Biden's constant gaffe's regarding the black community certainly is not helping his case.

Regarding Kamala Harris, I do think she was a horrible pick for the Biden campaign.  It is important to note that African-American black and Caribbean black are two separate and completely different cultures.  A black person in the United States has a completely different culture/mentality than one in Jamaica or Trinidad, for instance.  I know a few African-American blacks that do not consider her a true African American at all, and they are truly correct in that.  Her Jamaican lineage contains white (Irish) and black bloodlines (which is normal for a large part of the region), and she also has Indian heritage in her as well, Brahmin I think.  It is not like Kamala Harris is a sista from the hood, her family owned slaves on their Jamaican plantation even.  I can assure that picking her did nothing to move the black community in support of Biden, if anything it turned them against him even more.  Her AG record is another point I have heard several black men throw against her as well.  Biden read the room completely wrong on this one, Kamala Harris has no street credibility at all in the black community.

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I think that Biden made a large mistake in boxing himself into a female VP firstly, and a second blunder in limiting it to an African American (which Kamala Harris is not even).  The Democratic Party is never going to learn that running an identity politics campaign is a losing playbook.  I see no self reflection from since 2016 at all.

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9 minutes ago, CPE said:

I personally do believe that Trump will get at least 15% of the black vote

This is a pipe dream. Trump holds the record for the worst Republican performance with the black vote against a white Democrat in history. I don't expect him to do much better this time around.

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1 minute ago, Reagan04 said:

This is a pipe dream. Trump holds the record for the worst Republican performance with the black vote against a white Democrat in history. I don't expect him to do much better this time around.

Bear in mind that this is all anecdotal, but I have never seen so many black men around me come out in open support of the Republican Party.  I know a few that were staunch Obama supporters that claim to be voting Trump this go around.  Take it for what it is worth, being anecdotal evidence in all, but I do think that he is going to poll higher among African-Americans (particularly the men) than any Republican candidate in a while.  Not quite sure where to put my thumb on why, but I have seen support from individuals that I wouldn't expect in 2016, 2012, 2008, etc.  

We will see soon I guess.

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40 minutes ago, CPE said:

I know a few African-American blacks that do not consider her a true African American at all, and they are truly correct in that.

This is just completely false. Her ancestors came from Africa by way of Jamaica (part of the Americas). Not sure where you're getting the idea that she isn't part African-American.

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20 minutes ago, jnewt said:

This is just completely false. Her ancestors came from Africa by way of Jamaica (part of the Americas). Not sure where you're getting the idea that she isn't part African-American.

Caribbean black and American black cultures are completely separate from one another.  No one in the Caribbean identifies themselves as African-American, it is a term used in the States only from what I have seen.  If you say that you are African-American in the Bahamas, Jamaica, Trinidad, Haiti, etc. you will probably get laughed at.  In my mind, African American is a term used to denote an American black person vs one of another origion.  Caribbean, African etc.  I have never seen it used outside of the States in my life to be quite honest with you.

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37 minutes ago, jnewt said:

This is just completely false. Her ancestors came from Africa by way of Jamaica (part of the Americas). Not sure where you're getting the idea that she isn't part African-American.

Reading over your comment again, I think I know where we may have a misunderstanding.  In actual usage, African-"American" refers to the United States, while your definition refers to the Americas as a whole (a region).  I understand your point now, but will argue that she still is not a de facto African-American.  No one in the Caribbean region refers to themselves as such, and you would be hard pressed to find someone who identifies with the nomenclature in Jamaica.  It is an American term (as in the United States) alone.

To be quite honest, she would not even be considered black in this region.  In most places, she would be know as "mixed" or "mulatto", or would fit in better with those of Indian descent in Trinidad.  I honestly hate all of the politically correct wordplay, just call a spade a spade and be done with it.

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8 hours ago, CPE said:

Caribbean black and American black cultures are completely separate from one another.  No one in the Caribbean identifies themselves as African-American, it is a term used in the States only from what I have seen.  If you say that you are African-American in the Bahamas, Jamaica, Trinidad, Haiti, etc. you will probably get laughed at.  In my mind, African American is a term used to denote an American black person vs one of another origion.  Caribbean, African etc.  I have never seen it used outside of the States in my life to be quite honest with you.

It's hardly a revelation that someone who's not American would not be called African American.  Since Harris is American, the term African American is appropriate.

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31 minutes ago, pilight said:

It's hardly a revelation that someone who's not American would not be called African American.  Since Harris is American, the term African American is appropriate.

I will take my own advice and forget about the politically correct nomenclature, and just say the point that I am trying to get across.

Kamala Harris is not an American black by descent.  It is not like her family was there through Dred Scott, Reconstruction, the Great Migration etc.  Caribbean black culture is something completely different to American black culture, to apply the term African-American to her is disingenuous at best in my sight.  To me, African-American implies that you can claim some sort of ancestry of heritage in the American black community, which Kamala Harris cannot.

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1 hour ago, CPE said:

I will take my own advice and forget about the politically correct nomenclature, and just say the point that I am trying to get across.

Kamala Harris is not an American black by descent.  It is not like her family was there through Dred Scott, Reconstruction, the Great Migration etc.  Caribbean black culture is something completely different to American black culture, to apply the term African-American to her is disingenuous at best in my sight.  To me, African-American implies that you can claim some sort of ancestry of heritage in the American black community, which Kamala Harris cannot.

You make a good point, but I think that no one in the US much cares for that distinction. Or they're just uninterested.

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2 hours ago, CPE said:

I will take my own advice and forget about the politically correct nomenclature, and just say the point that I am trying to get across.

Kamala Harris is not an American black by descent.  It is not like her family was there through Dred Scott, Reconstruction, the Great Migration etc.  Caribbean black culture is something completely different to American black culture, to apply the term African-American to her is disingenuous at best in my sight.  To me, African-American implies that you can claim some sort of ancestry of heritage in the American black community, which Kamala Harris cannot.

And yet she grew up a black woman in a segregated America....

 

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2 hours ago, CPE said:

Kamala Harris is not an American black by descent.  It is not like her family was there through Dred Scott, Reconstruction, the Great Migration etc.  Caribbean black culture is something completely different to American black culture, to apply the term African-American to her is disingenuous at best in my sight.  To me, African-American implies that you can claim some sort of ancestry of heritage in the American black community, which Kamala Harris cannot.

A similar argument was made against Obama. Indeed, he didn't magically get the bulk of the black vote in the Dem primaries simply by having African ancestors. He had to earn it by convincing black voters voting for him was in their interests above voting for H. Clinton.

I think the same standard applies to Harris. She is of African ancestry, and an American citizen. Technically, she is certainly African-American. However, whether she has broad acceptance and support of her, in particular, in the African-American community is another question.

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3 hours ago, Hestia11 said:

You make a good point, but I think that no one in the US much cares for that distinction. Or they're just uninterested.

Fair enough, I agree with your point about most being uninterested.  I am someone that is a stickler for details personally though.

 

2 hours ago, admin_270 said:

A similar argument was made against Obama. Indeed, he didn't magically get the bulk of the black vote in the Dem primaries simply by having African ancestors. He had to earn it by convincing black voters voting for him was in their interests above voting for H. Clinton.

I think the same standard applies to Harris. She is of African ancestry, and an American citizen. Technically, she is certainly African-American. However, whether she has broad acceptance and support of her, in particular, in the African-American community is another question.

You and I must know different people, I know quite a few who voted for Obama just on the basis of being a black man.  I am sure that there are many voters who actually look at platforms/policy, but there are even more that only vote for someone who looks similar to them.  Identity politics is here to stay now that the floodgates have been opened in this regard.  Even the GOP has recognized this and are highlighting the Kimberly Klacik's and Candace Owen's of their party. 

Yes, I remember the debate surrounding Obama.  Even now, people often forget that he had a white mother.  It does not matter, see what some of the comments on the below post to help you understand where I am coming from.

https://twitter.com/tariqnasheed/status/1294027237260292096

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Descendants_of_Slavery

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Foundational%20Black%20American

The technical definition is completely irrelevant at the end of the day, only thing what matters is how many voters she is able to pull in.

I think that it was a good move on the GOP's part to target black voters in particular.  It will be harder to pull black women in due to section 8, single parent benefits, etc., but they can make serious inroads among black men if they play their cards right.  African-Americans generally tend to be much more ideologically conservative than white Americans nowadays, especially in the South.  Strong church attendance and religious affiliation, most don't support the LGBT movement, and Trump not being the usual rich white politician (he was an outsider before his Presidency) gives them an opening into the black community.  They seem to recognize that and are promoting black Republican's heavily.  We will see how many they are able to woo over.

 

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