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Forum Amendments for Article 2


Article 2 Proposals  

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  1. 1. Which changes should be made to our Constitution?

    • award electoral college votes proportionally (with a minimum threshold of 10% in order to win any EVs) Note: if this proposal and proposal 13 both secure a majority, only the proposal with more votes will be approved
    • hold presidential elections every six years and prohibit the President from running for reelection (though allow for non-consecutive terms) Note: if this proposal and proposal 14 both secure a majority, only the proposal with more votes will be approved
    •  abolish the office of Vice President
    • establish a new line of succession where the President is followed by the Vice President (if said office is not abolished) and then the members of the cabinet (in the order their positions were created)
    • The president must fill all open vacancies in all areas in which he or she can make an appointment. The president has 90 days to make a nomination, and Congress has 90 days to hear and confirm/deny or the position is automatically confirmed.
    • Presidential recall: In order to initiate a recall election, a petition (or petitions) must be signed by an amount of people greater than 50% of that state's voters in the previous Presidential election. If this criterion is met, a recall election will be held with the winner serving the balance of the term..
    • Trigger a special election whenever a non-nationwide-elected official (e.g. Speaker of the House or Secretary of State) ascends to the Presidency (unless it is within one year of a scheduled election)
    • remove the words "natural born citizen" from Section 1 Clause 5
    • a parliamentary system amendment (similar to the Westminister system, but only with the parts relevant for addition to the article)
    • ranked-choice voting for Presidential elections
    • for treaties, 2/3rd's of the Senate must APPROVE not 2/3rds must DISAPPROVE
    • eliminate the word "misdemeanors" from Section 4
    • abolish the Electoral College entirely and have a popular vote with a second round if no majority is gained in the first round, like in France Note: if this proposal and proposal 1 both secure a majority, only the proposal with more votes will be approved
    • Shorten the President's term to 2 years, but allow for the President to run for 3 consecutive terms Note: if this proposal and proposal 2 both secure a majority, only the proposal with more votes will be approved
    • Allow the President to call early elections
    • None of the above

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  • Poll closed on 07/16/2018 at 04:43 AM

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2 minutes ago, Caprice said:

I'd support the recall, except for the problem of the wording. The way it's worded, any sufficiently strong-leaning state could call for a recall and have its party's candidate become President.

Yeah, I'm confused if it meant just regarding 1 state, or 50% in every state. 

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1 hour ago, Caprice said:

I'd support the recall, except for the problem of the wording. The way it's worded, any sufficiently strong-leaning state could call for a recall and have its party's candidate become President.

 

1 hour ago, Sunnymentoaddict said:

Yeah, I'm confused if it meant just regarding 1 state, or 50% in every state. 

After compromising on that proposal, I left out an important part. There needs to be a majority of states (so, right now, 26) with petitions signed by an amount equal to a majority of the previous elections voters. So, at least 26 states would need to support a recall. If the proposal gets adopted I'll be sure to fix the wording.

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3 minutes ago, jnewt said:

 

After compromising on that proposal, I left out an important part. There needs to be a majority of states (so, right now, 26) with petitions signed by an amount equal to a majority of the previous elections voters. So, at least 26 states would need to support a recall. If the proposal gets adopted I'll be sure to fix the wording.

I'm going to make my opinion on the topic of Article 2 known, even though I can't express it by simply voting on the list above. I believe political culture, and society, not just in the U.S., but around the world, is too eager, intent, and desiring to bestow a single individual at one time - the one holding the relevant apex executive office of the polity relevant - too much singular power, responsibility, and authority for the purpose of the cultural fetish (and I do I indeed use the word "fetish" here) of a "powerful face of the government" and a "visible leader and symbol of the polity." However, I personally believe that this obsession, and the cults of personality and exalted that grows around many of these individuals, even in nations with seemingly the most well-thought-out checks and balances, are a huge contributor to the biggest political problems in the U.S., and the world, today. We should have learned this lesson, collectively, as a species, from the days of absolute monarchs and theocrats, and a more recent reminder in era of Fascism, when these issues were in their most obvious and acute forms. The reason the First French Republic had no single executive head, but a collective executive governance, was from a speech by Georges Danton that creating such a singular executive head would be "tantamount to enshrining a man to acquire the power and privilege to, under a new title and new pretense, nonetheless proceed to sit down on the throne we have just removed our tyrannical from." I support a committee-style executive collective head, instead of a singular individual.

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The reason the First French Republic had no single executive head, but a collective executive governance, was from a speech by Georges Danton that creating such a singular executive head would be "tantamount to enshrining a man to acquire the power and privilege to, under a new title and new pretense, nonetheless proceed to sit down on the throne we have just removed our tyrannical from."

Yeah, what we really need is out own Reign of Terror followed in short order by an imperial dictatorship.  

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3 minutes ago, pilight said:

Yeah, what we really need is out own Reign of Terror followed in short order by an imperial dictatorship.  

There were other reasons completely for the Reign of Terror and the Rise of Napoleon. You're flawed attempt at comparative logic is very transparent for the failure of a retort it is.

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@NYrepublican @ThePotatoWalrus  @TheLiberalKitten @vcczar @pilight @Sunnymentoaddict @WVProgressive @Thunder @Reagan04 @Ido @Caprice @Hestia11 @jnewt

My statement must be so bold, radical, and extreme that everyone else must be trying to process it, get their heads, and even imagine or comprehend how things could even work in the light I propose.

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Just now, Patine said:

@NYrepublican @ThePotatoWalrus  @TheLiberalKitten @vcczar @pilight @Sunnymentoaddict @WVProgressive @Thunder @Reagan04 @Ido @Caprice @Hestia11 @jnewt

My statement must be so bold, radical, and extreme that everyone else must be trying to process it, get their heads, and even imagine or comprehend how things could even work in the light I propose.

It wouldn't 

4 hours ago, pilight said:

Yeah, what we really need is out own Reign of Terror followed in short order by an imperial dictatorship.  

 

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4 minutes ago, Patine said:

@NYrepublican @ThePotatoWalrus  @TheLiberalKitten @vcczar @pilight @Sunnymentoaddict @WVProgressive @Thunder @Reagan04 @Ido @Caprice @Hestia11 @jnewt

My statement must be so bold, radical, and extreme that everyone else must be trying to process it, get their heads, and even imagine or comprehend how things could even work in the light I propose.

Get off your damn high horse, that was pompous as hell, even for you who has a penchant for such grandiose pronouncements.

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2 minutes ago, Reagan04 said:

Get off your damn high horse, that was pompous as hell, even for you who has a penchant for such grandiose pronouncements.

Lmao i'm gonna pull a Switzerland on this one.

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Just now, NYrepublican said:

It wouldn't 

 

Tell me why it inherently wouldn't or couldn't work by nature without regurgitating @pilight's feeble use of a chain of historical events in one specific instance that were NOT caused by the fact that a lack of a singular existed, but, as I said, occurred for completely reasons and using that as the reason by either of you is a pathetic deflationary tactic and NOT evidence or real argument against. I haven't heard a REAL reason that my proposal is inherently unworkable yet.

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2 minutes ago, Patine said:

Tell me why it inherently wouldn't or couldn't work by nature without regurgitating @pilight's feeble use of a chain of historical events in one specific instance that were NOT caused by the fact that a lack of a singular existed, but, as I said, occurred for completely reasons and using that as the reason by either of you is a pathetic deflationary tactic and NOT evidence or real argument against. I haven't heard a REAL reason that my proposal is inherently unworkable yet.

Simple all the executives will hate each other and it'll devolve into a mess.

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3 minutes ago, Reagan04 said:

Get off your damn high horse, that was pompous as hell, even for you who has a penchant for such grandiose pronouncements.

Oh? My high horse? Why did your high horse you've often been sitting on the time I've known you on these forums die recently and you're feeling envious?

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4 hours ago, Patine said:

You're flawed attempt at comparative logic is very transparent for the failure of a retort it is.

I know I said I was gonna stay out of this but I can't help it.

I'm so sorry, but...

*your

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Just now, NYrepublican said:

Simple all the executives will hate each other and it'll devolve into a mess.

That's not a good enough to invest and entrust so much power in a single individual and say they represent, head, and guide the interests of a whole diverse population with any sincerity or honesty. It's better an executive committee of bitter rivals than a single executive head who ends up hated by a majority of the nation but is allowed to carry on their duties to represent and govern that whole nation regardless.

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1 minute ago, Patine said:

That's not a good enough to invest and entrust so much power in a single individual and say they represent, head, and guide the interests of a whole diverse population with any sincerity or honesty. It's better an executive committee of bitter rivals than a single executive head who ends up hated by a majority of the nation but is allowed to carry on their duties to represent and govern that whole nation regardless.

Nothing could ever get done show me one successful nation that has that that's not some variant of the westminster system.

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1 minute ago, NYrepublican said:

Nothing could ever get done show me one successful nation that has that that's not some variant of the westminster system.

@ThePotatoWalrus just did. You must have missed it. Switzerland. Probably more successfully run and managed than most other First World Nations today - especially the U.S.

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Instead of getting negative I found some political themed jokes for y'all

Joke One
Breaking News: Bill Gates has agreed to pay for Trump's wall
On the condition he gets to install windows.

Joke Two
Trump should not have said "shit-hole countries".
The correct term is "turd-world countries".

Joke Three
The Pope and Trump are on stage in front of a huge crowd.
The Pope leaned towards Mr. Trump and said, "Do you know that with one little wave of my hand I can make every person in this crowd go wild with joy? This joy will not be a momentary display, like that of your followers, but go deep into their hearts and for the rest of their lives whenever they speak of this day, they will rejoice!"

Trump replied, "I seriously doubt that. With one little wave of your hand? Show me!"

So the Pope slapped him.

Joke Four
Liberals are acting like Trump is going to kill all the gays, make slavery legal again, and take away women's rights....
Like he's a Muslim or something.

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17 minutes ago, Patine said:

@ThePotatoWalrus just did. You must have missed it. Switzerland. Probably more successfully run and managed than most other First World Nations today - especially the U.S.

oo that was smooth

Edit: Meh nvm

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6 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

There's one executive Alain Barsett

No, there's a rotating, unofficial, and legally non-binding primus inter pares member of a Federation Council that is the Constitutional Collective Head-of-State who legally have equal power.

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8 hours ago, Patine said:

@NYrepublican @ThePotatoWalrus  @TheLiberalKitten @vcczar @pilight @Sunnymentoaddict @WVProgressive @Thunder @Reagan04 @Ido @Caprice @Hestia11 @jnewt

My statement must be so bold, radical, and extreme that everyone else must be trying to process it, get their heads, and even imagine or comprehend how things could even work in the light I propose.

I'd prefer multiple executives to one. Maybe like one to five with one of them up for reelection each year, with only one reelection attempt. 

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