Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 since Jerusalem Day is coming up and Trump's referring to jerusalem as Jerusalem,Israel I decided to put up the poll. by jerusalem I mean the old city portion fo Jerusalem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bruce Fischer 1 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 I mean I guess? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, Bruce Fischer said: I mean I guess? I mean as a political thing Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pilight 240 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 The UN doesn't recognize Jerusalem as the capital. Â Neither does any country other than Israel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, pilight said: The UN doesn't recognize Jerusalem as the capital. Â Neither does any country other than Israel. shouldn't Israel have the right to determine it's capital? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, pilight said: The UN doesn't recognize Jerusalem as the capital. Â Neither does any country other than Israel. that and as of today Trump's administration does. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pilight 240 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 12 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: shouldn't Israel have the right to determine it's capital? It has to be within their country. Â The area of Jerusalem is in dispute. 13 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: that and as of today Trump's administration does. We'll see if the embassy gets moved. Â Currently it is in Tel Aviv, the internationally recognized capital. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, pilight said: It has to be within their country. Â The area of Jerusalem is in dispute. We'll see if the embassy gets moved. Â Currently it is in Tel Aviv, the internationally recognized capital. the new city part is not in dispute. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pilight 240 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 7 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: the new city part is not in dispute. Yes, but you said... 1 hour ago, republicaninnyc said: by jerusalem I mean the old city portion fo Jerusalem  Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, pilight said: Yes, but you said... Â when i said the new city part I meant moving the embassy to the new city section of Jerusalem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 514 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 1 hour ago, republicaninnyc said: since Jerusalem Day is coming up and Trump's referring to jerusalem as Jerusalem,Israel I decided to put up the poll. by jerusalem I mean the old city portion fo Jerusalem. There was a similar dispute during the Cold War, when East Germany declared unilaterally East Berlin as it's formal capital, when the Berlin was divided into formal occupation zones between the Four Powers (the U.S., the U.K., and France, whose zones formed West Berlin, that was not TECHNICALLY part of West Germany, and West Berliners had no votes in the Bundestag unless they had a secondary residence in West Germany - the Soviet zone, which was East Berlin), and Berlin was LEGALLY and TECHNICALLY not part of either Germany by the Four-Germany Agreement, but was administrated under the JURISDICTION of each occupying power (TECHNICALLY), a state of affairs which wasn't OFFICIALLY rescinded until Re-unification in October 1990. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, Patine said: There was a similar dispute during the Cold War, when East Germany declared unilaterally East Berlin as it's formal capital, when the Berlin was divided into formal occupation zones between the Four Powers (the U.S., the U.K., and France, whose zones formed West Berlin, that was not TECHNICALLY part of West Germany, and West Berliners had no votes in the Bundestag unless they had a secondary residence in West Germany - the Soviet zone, which was East Berlin), and Berlin was LEGALLY and TECHNICALLY not part of either Germany by the Four-Germany Agreement, but was administrated under the JURISDICTION of each occupying power (TECHNICALLY), a state of affairs which wasn't OFFICIALLY rescinded until Re-unification in October 1990. acutally East berlin was part of the soviet zone. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 514 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, republicaninnyc said: acutally East berlin was part of the soviet zone. Yes, exactly, but East Germany having it as it's capital violated the Four Power Agreement, and the NATO countries didn't recognize it in 1961. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Just now, Patine said: Yes, exactly, but East Germany having it as it's capital violated the Four Power Agreement, and the NATO countries didn't recognize it in 1961. to my knowledge Israel has not signed any such pact. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 514 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: to my knowledge Israel has not signed any such pact. Still, the city, as an entire city, is disputed. If they openly labelled and called their capital official as "West Jerusalem," I bet there wouldn't be an issue, but a man like Netanyahu seems to prefer to seek out conflict rather than prevent it. That is why, among many other things, he is my LEAST favourite PM of Israel, and I have a decent degree of familiarity with the list. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 1 minute ago, Patine said: Still, the city, as an entire city, is disputed. If they openly labelled and called their capital official as "West Jerusalem," I bet there wouldn't be an issue, but a man like Netanyahu seems to prefer to seek out conflict rather than prevent it. That is why, among many other things, he is my LEAST favourite PM of Israel, and I have a decent degree of familiarity with the list. there's also only been like 5 prime ministers. that and if they labeled the capital as west jerusalem (called the new city) it'd cause the Govt. to collapse so Netanyahu's hands are tied even if he'd want to do that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bruce Fischer 1 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 24 minutes ago, Patine said: Still, the city, as an entire city, is disputed. If they openly labelled and called their capital official as "West Jerusalem," I bet there wouldn't be an issue, but a man like Netanyahu seems to prefer to seek out conflict rather than prevent it. That is why, among many other things, he is my LEAST favourite PM of Israel, and I have a decent degree of familiarity with the list. I agree with Netanyahu on most social issues it seems, but we disagree on economics (a little bit) and defense (a lot, he's a hawk while I'm more dovish) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, Bruce Fischer said: I agree with Netanyahu on most social issues it seems, but we disagree on economics (a little bit) and defense (a lot, he's a hawk while I'm more dovish) according to what? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 @Bruce Fischer i'd like to take that test. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bruce Fischer 1 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 38 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: according to what? His wikipedia page's description of his political views (which is why I said "it seems" in case there's something we disagree on not mentioned there). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jvikings1 43 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 The entire city of Jerusalem is the capital of Israel and should be regained as such by the US and the international community. It is also completely part of Israel. the US embasy should be moved to Jerusalem, and I am really hoping that Trump takes the initiative to do it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 14 minutes ago, jvikings1 said: The entire city of Jerusalem is the capital of Israel and should be regained as such by the US and the international community. It is also completely part of Israel. the US embasy should be moved to Jerusalem, and I am really hoping that Trump takes the initiative to do it. Agree. This is my personal opinion please no nasty comments. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 @Patine I believe such since I believe that all of Jerusalem is Israeli territory and Israel should have the right to have its capital there. 14 minutes ago, republicaninnyc said: Agree. This is my personal opinion please no nasty comments.  Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 514 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 20 minutes ago, jvikings1 said: The entire city of Jerusalem is the capital of Israel and should be regained as such by the US and the international community. It is also completely part of Israel. the US embasy should be moved to Jerusalem, and I am really hoping that Trump takes the initiative to do it. This is the type of uncompromising, unreasonable, unproductive loggerheads attitude that Netanyahu and his supporter, and there direct opposites but analogs in groups like Hamas that is REALLY what's preventing any sort of resolution whatsoever and all peace agreements always break down. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Patine said: This is the type of uncompromising, unreasonable, unproductive loggerheads attitude that Netanyahu and his supporter, and there direct opposites but analogs in groups like Hamas that is REALLY what's preventing any sort of resolution whatsoever and all peace agreements always break down. well Patine the palestinians have never had sovereignty over Jerusalem and the PLO charter only mentioned Jerusalem in the '68 amendments not in the original '64 version. (1964 version:http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=640&doc_id=8210) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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