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A poll about you guys


A poll about you guys  

35 members have voted

  1. 1. How old are you?

    • 10-15
      4
    • 16-20
      17
    • 21-30
      11
    • 31-40
      1
    • 41-50
      2
    • 51-60
      0
    • 61-70
      0
    • I'm older than 70
      0
  2. 2. What party do you identify yourself with?

    • Republican
      9
    • Democrat
      9
    • Libertarian
      4
    • Green
      1
    • Socialist Party
      0
    • Workers World Party
      0
    • American Nazi Party
      0
    • Constitution
      1
    • I don't identify with any party
      11
  3. 3. What was the first election you could vote in?

    • 2016
      10
    • 2012
      3
    • 2008
      0
    • 2004
      1
    • 2000
      1
    • 1996
      1
    • 1992
      0
    • 1988
      1
    • 1984
      0
    • 1988
      0
    • 1984
      0
    • 1980
      0
    • 1976
      0
    • 1972
      0
    • 1968
      0
    • I didn't vote
      3
    • I'm not old enough to vote
      15


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5 minutes ago, Bruce Fischer said:

So in 2012 I first got "into" politics, but I put that in quotes because it was mostly because that's what other people were interested in since there was an election. I didn't love Romney but since I took all of my parent's (who were and still are conservatives) views and made them my own (I was 12 and wasn't really my own person yet) I hated Obama and wanted Romney to win. (I have a feeling that growing up in the church made me more conservative as well, though I'm still religious; it's a myth that you can't be progressive and religious) Then I stopped caring for 3 years, during which I became my own person both politically and in the other areas of my life. I started watching election stuff again right after Trump announced, and his rhetoric repulsed me but I laughed it off at the time because he was never going to win a primary, much less the nomination. A "President Trump" was unfathomable. But then I watched the Republican debate that August, and I discovered that I didn't actually like any Republican candidate. Then I watched the next Democratic debate and I didn't like Clinton but Bernie really resonated with me. I started to form my own opinions (that were based around Bernie's but not a carbon copy) on issues. Around March of 2016 two things happened: I started to fall out of love with Bernie (probably because I was shifting away from him ideologically as I was forming more solid opinions on issues) and to appreciate Hillary Clinton's technocratic demeanor and down-to-earth vision for America even if I wasn't enthusiastic about her as a person or candidate, and I realized that I love politics when I debated Social Security reform and realized that I had a lot of fun doing so. Then last fall I started community college (dually enrolled homeschooler, that's how I'm a 17-year-old college student), majored in political science and took a national government class with an absolutely excellent professor who really encouraged us to think for ourselves and develop our own opinions, and then often facilitated debates between us. That sealed the deal and now I want to dedicate myself to this field. I'm still evolving; I've shifted around on a few issues since there's no longer the polarization of election season. I've also learned a lot about state and local governments since I'm taking a class on it (with the same awesome professor from my national gov class), and right now I'm exploring US political history. (I just bought a biography of Nelson Rockefeller on Sunday and the older guy who checked me out gave me a funny look and asked why I, a teenager, cared about Gerald Ford's Vice President :P)

I live in the only majority-Republican district in Maryland so being not-a-Republican has been an interesting experience; my youth pastor straight-up told me that I must automatically want unlimited abortions, and my own parents flipped out when they found out I used the term "liberal" to describe myself once. My best friend, who voted for Trump, is pretty much the only IRL person I can talk to about politics and actually say what I believe, even though we don't agree on anything. Which is why I like this forum, because I can express my political beliefs, have them challenged, and refine those beliefs.

For me, I had the opposite issue, I grew up in a largely liberal family, and now my parents live in California so...  I was a Democrat right up until about mid-2009, after I saw the Obama Presidency wasn't adding up.  Still I was apathetic for a while, but in 2009 I saw an appearance of Glenn Beck on Jay Leno and I realized that I actually agreed with a lot of what he was saying, then I started, as you did, educating myself more on issues and I had to re-evaluate my entire world view.  But overall, I will echo Ronald Reagan's answer to a similar question: I didn't leave the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party left me.  Although economically liberal for a long time, I still was against illegal immigration and was generally conservative in lifestyle, so part of it was a policy change, but part of it was simply re-defining beliefs that I already had.

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11 minutes ago, servo75 said:

Certainly not all terrorists, but certainly the most visible and violent.  I've never heard of Christian terrorists blowing themselves up and trying to destroy Western values, or Radical Jews flying airplanes into buildings.  Radical Islam gave rise to the Terror State in the Middle East, so Trump is essentially right in the big picture.  That's not "attacking" Muslims, just stating facts.

I was in the Olympic Park just a couple of hours before it was bombed by the Christian Identity guy, who did it explicitly to undermine Western values.

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3 minutes ago, servo75 said:

For me, I had the opposite issue, I grew up in a largely liberal family, and now my parents live in California so...  I was a Democrat right up until about mid-2009, after I saw the Obama Presidency wasn't adding up.  Still I was apathetic for a while, but in 2009 I saw an appearance of Glenn Beck on Jay Leno and I realized that I actually agreed with a lot of what he was saying, then I started, as you did, educating myself more on issues and I had to re-evaluate my entire world view.  But overall, I will echo Ronald Reagan's answer to a similar question: I didn't leave the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party left me.  Although economically liberal for a long time, I still was against illegal immigration and was generally conservative in lifestyle, so part of it was a policy change, but part of it was simply re-defining beliefs that I already had.

I have not yet found a political party, candidate, or ideologue ANYWHERE that truly sums up my beliefs and political world view (or that I sum up theirs) anywhere - in the world actually. I find grave and critical flaws in all of them that often spoil what good points any of them may have. At best, my voting is strategic. Here's some lyrics from a song from the '90's (my young adult decade), that some up the feelings I often get in my own political views and how they relate to others.

Stepped out of the line
Like a sheep runs from the herd
Marching out of time
To my own beat now
The only way I know
One light, one mind
Flashing in the dark
Blinded by the silence of a thousand broken hearts
"For crying out loud" she screamed unto me
A free for all
F**k 'em all
You're on your own side

'Cause I want to be the minority
I don't need your authority
Down with the moral majority
'Cause I want to be the minority

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48 minutes ago, Bruce Fischer said:

Yes I know how elections work. I wouldn't say national polls mean "nothing," they just don't mean everything. Again, polls tend to be between 7-10 days behind current public opinion so last-minute events such as the Comey letter may have affected the election while not showing up in polls (or a bunch of people could've just lied to pollsters). Polls are never perfect but to act like they were totally off and that no one predicted President Trump and that polls now cannot be trusted is not the lesson I would take away from the 2016 election.

Last minute events, while many don't think it had that much impact, are another reason to not trust polls.  No one major predicted a Trump victory because the state polls were way off, just like Brexit (obviously without the state thing). But, for the record, I predicted a Trump victory and won $20 off of it with some friends.  Also, the lying to the pollsters is what the shadow voters are which were first seen in mass in Brexit.

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In regards to "Christian" terrorists, you have to look to see if they are actually Christians. The answer is pretty simple: no. They are just using Christianity to gain attention.  No where in the Bible does it say to go kill those who don't convert.

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17 minutes ago, jvikings1 said:

In regards to "Christian" terrorists, you have to look to see if they are actually Christians. The answer is pretty simple: no. They are just using Christianity to gain attention.  No where in the Bible does it say to go kill those who don't convert.

As a Christian, I would disagree :P

Deuteronomy 17

If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Deuteronomy 13

 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in 13 that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

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2 hours ago, jvikings1 said:

In regards to "Christian" terrorists, you have to look to see if they are actually Christians. The answer is pretty simple: no. They are just using Christianity to gain attention.  No where in the Bible does it say to go kill those who don't convert.

 

1 hour ago, CalebsParadox said:

As a Christian, I would disagree :P

Deuteronomy 17

If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Deuteronomy 13

 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in 13 that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

Let me make something very clear. Almost every religion in history has had religious leaders amongst it who warped twisted, distorted, misinterpreted, or even directly lied about that religion's tenets, or attempted to change them by "revelation," "revision," "reform," "or returning to (perceived) fundamentals," for the purpose of personal gain, turning the religion to a vehicle of power, attacking their PERSONAL enemies or those they PERSONALLY dislike, engineering societies to their PERSONAL vision, and waging wars for their PERSONAL ends - up to and including going so far as committing the worst atrocities, making the most draconian "religious" laws, and allowing horrible corruption, which are actually antithetical to the real, original religion's core teachings, to the point that many, both followers and criticism, come to believe that's how the religion is properly practiced. As I said, every religion in the world and in history has suffered from this to some degree or another. But the two religions that have, BY FAR, suffered worst from this phenomenon are Christianity and Islam...

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11 hours ago, Bruce Fischer said:

*former Bernie supporter, I became disenchanted with his vague platitudes around March of last year, and threw my support (though I can't vote so it didn't mean anything) behind Hillary Clinton, even though I'm to the left of her and found her ethically questionable (though not to the extent that the media made it out to be). I think Bernie would've won - easily - and I'm absolutely astounded at how incompetent of a campaign Robby Mook ran, but had even a few things been different (*coughComeylettercough*), I think Clinton would've won.

I'm absolutely not a communist, and I don't think I'm a socialist either. I'm much closer to the center than either of those terms suggest, think JFK but in the 21st century and slightly more to the left

I'm not, I despise the death penalty and see it as a disgusting human rights violation that has its roots in ancient Babylon, which is not a society I want to live in

I believe in most left wing economic policies, with the notable exception of wanting a balanced budget and reduced debt

I also support LGBTQ+ rights, and seeing the way Duterte is going I wouldn't be surprised if you get your wish. I can't stand the man, if I do say so myself; Duterte is one of the select few world leaders who I wouldn't take over Trump.

Duterte and trump are drastically different, the only reason they are compared is because of the way they talk, but I believe in all aspects duterte is better.

Duterte is actually a good person, during the typhoon haiyan on 2013 he has helped a lot of people even in his own city.

He is more of a bernie sanders except for some issues.

Duterte has more experience than trump, duterte has served as mayor for 22 years. And congressman for 3 years. 

During the election duterte didn't campaign on his accomplishments but he campaigned on the issues and what he will do if elected. 

As ironic as this sounds, the liberal media in a lot of foreign countries are portraying him as an atuhoritarian ruler , when in fact it's the exact opposite. 

IMO foreign media just take the news from local media , what they do not know is that the media here in my country is extremely incompetent and FANATICALLY Opposed to duterte. 

The politics here in the philippines is extremely complex, there is no REAL political party and there is no REAL liberal and conservative.

I would also like to point out that Duterte is a leading Pro-Islam politician, his city was the first to do something about tribes and Muslim people. 

Duterte's cabinet is one of the best, considering the fact that it is complete in terms of political leanings, he has socialists in his cabinet, he has opposition in his cabinet he even has cabinet members that are Corporate people or whatever you call them in your country. 

His cabinet has a member of the Magdalo party (which is extremly againts him) 

People criticize him because of human rights, freedom of speech or what ever , but in fact.

Human rights is not a problem actually , according to what I have seen or heared most in my city most people are okay  with killing druglords. Actually drugs has become a cancer to our nation, hindering progress both economically and as a country.

He may be a rude person , but I will paraphrase him in this one "I may hate you and your opinions, but I will have to defend your right to say it."

So In my opinion, Duterte is way better than trump. 

Trump is a person who divides a nation. 

Duterte may not be very good but he has united some of my country.

Some Non-terrorist muslim rebel groups has united behind him. (Even helping the government eradicate the terrorist group ASG)

CPP-NDF-NPA  a communist group has backed him ( they have been rebelling since 1969)

Some right-wingers even sided with him. 

*fact:Duterte won 95 % of the vote of his city. And 89% of his region and 50 + something in the southern portion of my country. 

*Duterte won a landslide gaining 39 % of the total votes with other 4 candidates gaining the rest. 

I dont know the purpose of me typing all of these stuff but I just wanna say that comparing duterte to trump is very unfair. 

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12 hours ago, Bruce Fischer said:

*former Bernie supporter, I became disenchanted with his vague platitudes around March of last year, and threw my support (though I can't vote so it didn't mean anything) behind Hillary Clinton, even though I'm to the left of her and found her ethically questionable (though not to the extent that the media made it out to be). I think Bernie would've won - easily - and I'm absolutely astounded at how incompetent of a campaign Robby Mook ran, but had even a few things been different (*coughComeylettercough*), I think Clinton would've won.

I'm absolutely not a communist, and I don't think I'm a socialist either. I'm much closer to the center than either of those terms suggest, think JFK but in the 21st century and slightly more to the left

I'm not, I despise the death penalty and see it as a disgusting human rights violation that has its roots in ancient Babylon, which is not a society I want to live in

I believe in most left wing economic policies, with the notable exception of wanting a balanced budget and reduced debt

I also support LGBTQ+ rights, and seeing the way Duterte is going I wouldn't be surprised if you get your wish. I can't stand the man, if I do say so myself; Duterte is one of the select few world leaders who I wouldn't take over Trump.

I understand your opinion about the death penalty , but most countries in southeast asia has it. 

Maybe the reason I love the death penalty is because I personally and many other people close to me has been victimized by criminals, petty and organized alike. 

Maybe because crime had been very rampant in my country, Although I understand your opinion. 

Sadly in my country LGBT rights is way far behind, the "Anti descrimination Act" hasn't even been taken to a vote. 

Sometimes I wish the people in my country is as liberal as they are in the USA.

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8 hours ago, jvikings1 said:

In regards to "Christian" terrorists, you have to look to see if they are actually Christians. The answer is pretty simple: no. They are just using Christianity to gain attention.  No where in the Bible does it say to go kill those who don't convert.

One might ask the same of Muslim terrorists.  They often don't follow other tenets of the religion, but use the predominant religion of their area to gain legitimacy.

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2 hours ago, pilight said:

One might ask the same of Muslim terrorists.  They often don't follow other tenets of the religion, but use the predominant religion of their area to gain legitimacy.

It is true that they don't follow many parts.  They pick and chose which parts they are going to follow.

8 hours ago, Patine said:

 

Let me make something very clear. Almost every religion in history has had religious leaders amongst it who warped twisted, distorted, misinterpreted, or even directly lied about that religion's tenets, or attempted to change them by "revelation," "revision," "reform," "or returning to (perceived) fundamentals," for the purpose of personal gain, turning the religion to a vehicle of power, attacking their PERSONAL enemies or those they PERSONALLY dislike, engineering societies to their PERSONAL vision, and waging wars for their PERSONAL ends - up to and including going so far as committing the worst atrocities, making the most draconian "religious" laws, and allowing horrible corruption, which are actually antithetical to the real, original religion's core teachings, to the point that many, both followers and criticism, come to believe that's how the religion is properly practiced. As I said, every religion in the world and in history has suffered from this to some degree or another. But the two religions that have, BY FAR, suffered worst from this phenomenon are Christianity and Islam...

I will not dispute anything here.

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22 hours ago, CalebsParadox said:

As a Christian, I would disagree :P

Deuteronomy 17

If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Deuteronomy 13

 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in 13 that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

Those where the laws governing the Israelites which were God's people.  Additionally, that is Old Testament stuff which is mostly history now.  That is not a similar comparison to Islamic terrorism.

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1 minute ago, jvikings1 said:

Those where the laws governing the Israelites which were God's people.  Additionally, that is Old Testament stuff which is mostly history now.  That is not a similar comparison to Islamic terrorism.

This is true. When the Temple was up in the old Kingdoms of Israel and Judah in Antiquity, Jewish law at the time was about as harsh and nasty as what the Wahabi school of Islam's (the school adhered to by al-Qaeda, ISIS, the Taliban, Saudi law, and others) view of Sharia Law is today - but, to be fair, all the other nations around and contemporary to the Ancient Kingdoms of Israel and Judah had really nasty law codes and forms of punishment, too, and many of those were far less consistent, far less reliable, and far more given to blatant whimsy, corruption, and abuse by local authorities.

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