Government Idealogy Poll

[Reagan04 658]

4 minutes ago, Dallas said:

Just voted. Was split in the middle of right and far-right, as a few issues (marijuana and foreign policy) tend to be more towards isolationist, vs. the war hawks that dominate the GOP. Voted far-right anyway. Just to be clear, I do believe in a federal government. But a federal government that protects us from foreign attacks. Beyond that, I am very much a state rights person in most areas. With the exception of a few stances, mainly same-sex marriage.

 

agreed I was stuck between the two but I went for Right, maybe should have went Far-Right but I stand by my decision.

[Patine 469]

I might actually be amongst one of the oldest still active here. I first voted in a city election in 1994...

[jvikings1 40]

One huge reason why I do not like the Libertarian Party, even though I consider myself a Libertarian leaning Constitutional Conservative, is because of their stance on open borders which would be disastrous for the job market and the economy. That would also be an invasion on the sovereignty of the US as a nation.

[vcczar 1,224]

We're just waiting for @Patine, I think. 

[servo75 30]

34 minutes ago, jvikings1 said:

One huge reason why I do not like the Libertarian Party, even though I consider myself a Libertarian leaning Constitutional Conservative, is because of their stance on open borders which would be disastrous for the job market and the economy. That would also be an invasion on the sovereignty of the US as a nation.

I agree with you on that, but when I look at Libertarianism in the aggregate, I still think it's overall the best philosophy.  From a Libertarian point of view, this is one of those topics where there is a wide range of opinions, because some see it as "people should be free to come here and work" and others (like you and me) see it as "personal freedom means protection from the higher cost, fewer jobs, and less national security."  Though I will say that after studying the LP platform on immigration, I don't interpret it as "open borders", I think they are interested in vetting people, and having some semblance of a border fence.  But they also favor pathway to citizenship which I am against.

[servo75 30]

39 minutes ago, Patine said:

I might actually be amongst one of the oldest still active here. I first voted in a city election in 1994...

Well my first POTUS vote was in 1996 (I won't name the candidate), though I was old enough to vote in 1994.

[vcczar 1,224]

@servo75, Why won't you name the candidate?

[Reagan04 658]

@servo75 its alright we're all friends here, I think that there is ample evidence we respect all political philosophies!

I voted Buchanan!

[servo75 30]

Just now, vcczar said:

@servo75, Why won't you name the candidate?

Ok yes I voted for Clinton in 1996 and Gore in 2000.  I plead insanity and a victim of leftist media.   Though I would give Reagan's answer about "the party left me."  Back in the day I considered myself a Center-Left Democrat, was on the fence through the 2000s, but as I started to see the party go toward the SJW and PC nonsense, by 2008 I had enough.  But even in my Michael Dukakis / Bill Clinton days I would have been against the "social justice" "Black Lives Matter" crap.  Funny, as a teen I was staunchly anti-drug, so I've flopped on a lot of things.

I think the way to "convert" liberals, which I know first-hand, is to present them with the facts, and get them to realize that they' really are Libertarian at heart.  As soon as I (reluctantly at first) started listening to right-wing radio circa 2008, I realized, "Hey this actually makes more sense."  It was as simple as that.

[servo75 30]

1 minute ago, servo75 said:

 

I also have to say that when I was coming up through high school in the early 1990s, this was before indoctrination had really hit full steam.  My 8th grade Social Studies teacher was obviously for Dukakis over Bush and she made no attempt to hide, but I think we overall were taught very well and we didn't have all the crap that kids have to sit through today.  Some of my favorite teachers were in history, and I give them a lot of credit for not trying to steer us to one side or the other.  And in college, I went to a small technical college so it was a rather apolitical atmosphere.

[Reagan04 658]

2 minutes ago, servo75 said:

Ok yes I voted for Clinton in 1996 and Gore in 2000.  I plead insanity and a victim of leftist media.   Though I would give Reagan's answer about "the party left me."  Back in the day I considered myself a Center-Left Democrat, was on the fence through the 2000s, but as I started to see the party go toward the SJW and PC nonsense, by 2008 I had enough.  But even in my Michael Dukakis / Bill Clinton days I would have been against the "social justice" "Black Lives Matter" crap.  Funny, as a teen I was staunchly anti-drug, so I've flopped on a lot of things.

I think the way to "convert" liberals, which I know first-hand, is to present them with the facts, and get them to realize that they' really are Libertarian at heart.  As soon as I (reluctantly at first) started listening to right-wing radio circa 2008, I realized, "Hey this actually makes more sense."  It was as simple as that.

4

1) I voted Obama in 2012 (School election) for the same reason you voted Clinton and Gore in 96 and 00. I was being bombarded LEFT and right with pro-Obama nonsense. We have a similar "conversion story"

2)That's actually an interesting way to look at it!

[Reagan04 658]

1 minute ago, servo75 said:

I also have to say that when I was coming up through high school in the early 1990s, this was before indoctrination had really hit full steam.  My 8th grade Social Studies teacher was obviously for Dukakis over Bush and she made no attempt to hide, but I think we overall were taught very well and we didn't have all the crap that kids have to sit through today.  And in college, I went to a small technical college so it was a rather apolitical atmosphere.

 

My Social Studies Teacher is amazing, she often refers to me for help (We are doing Post-Mexican American War through Roaring Twenties/Progressive Era depending on how fast we move this year) However she is so Pro-Hillary I can barely stomach it, in the primaries it was better when all she would do is attack Bernie and say that I quote " It's Hill's turn!" But now is so much more pro-Clinton than even anti-trump, although she does hate the man.

[servo75 30]

Just now, Reagan04 said:

My Social Studies Teacher is amazing, she often refers to me for help (We are doing Post-Mexican American War through Roaring Twenties/Progressive Era depending on how fast we move this year) However she is so Pro-Hillary I can barely stomach it, in the primaries it was better when all she would do is attack Bernie and say that I quote " It's Hill's turn!" But now is so much more pro-Clinton than even anti-trump, although she does hate the man.

Yeah I have no problem with that.  I mean in a math class, politics would be totally inappropriate (though I'm glad I get to cover a unit on voting and apportionment this year), but in Social Studies, politics is tough to avoid, but as long as they don't try to sway you toward their view, it's ok.  I remember our Honors History teacher (this would be during the first Persian Gulf War) had a saying, "You can't legislate morality."  And the teacher in the next room was a Vietnam vet who wore a fatigues jacket every day.  Don't see too many like that these days I'd expect.

[vcczar 1,224]

@servo75 I've listened to right wing radio, and occasionally still do just to see what they're saying. I rarely find anything convincing. Not every liberal is PC or a Social Justice Warrior (SJW). In college, I had the opposite. I had a college government teacher that referred to Bill Clinton routinely as "The Thing in the White House" and a history teacher that disliked LBJ so much that he refused to call LBJ Expressway by its name. I honestly don't think professors really influence or indoctrinate their students. I was more conservative then, but I in no way were influenced by these teachers. If anything, they helped me go the other way. 

I think Johnson and Weld is easily the best Libertarian Ticket in the history of their party. Especially Weld, who I think should be at the top of the ticket. Much better than the deranged Ron Paul. I'd say I agree with about 40% of the party, but the part I disagree with is pretty stark. I'd prefer the federal government over my state government (I live in Texas). I prefer the federal government running the country rather than corporations. I like capitalism, but I think it needs some doses of Socialism to really work for everyone. I think the government should fund science, education, infrastructure, technology. I believe in an income tax to help pay for these things. Where I agree with Libertarians is that I'm pretty much a pacifist, I want to reduce the defense budget, I believe our privacy is invaded with the Patriot Act and other similar legislation, and I think most drugs should be decriminalized if not legal. 

But I can understand fiscal conservatism, though. I can't understand social conservatism. I'd probably be more inclined to Libertarianism if I lived in New England, since I trust those state governments. Both parties are sane in that region. It's probably because I live in Texas, with a bunch of Ted Cruz's, that make the concept of Libertarianism quite frightening since the state would have more influence on my life. 

Maybe the Libertarian Party will evolve into something appealing to me. Johnson/Weld is a start. I think if they favored wiping out student debt, I'd be on board. Education should be free anyway. The interest rates are insane. I've nearly paid back as much as I owed, and because of interest I still haven't paid back more than half of it. 

 

[Reagan04 658]

4 minutes ago, servo75 said:

Yeah I have no problem with that.  I mean in a math class, politics would be totally inappropriate (though I'm glad I get to cover a unit on voting and apportionment this year), but in Social Studies, politics is tough to avoid, but as long as they don't try to sway you toward their view, it's ok.  I remember our Honors History teacher (this would be during the first Persian Gulf War) had a saying, "You can't legislate morality."  And the teacher in the next room was a Vietnam vet who wore a fatigues jacket every day.  Don't see too many like that these days I'd expect.

 

Hmph, you should meet my math teacher, he goes off, luckily for me he is Conservative, but for the Liberals (however few), hoho they are in for a treat!

[lok1999 0]

Centre-left.

And since we, for some reason, are also talking about ages, i'm 16

[vcczar 1,224]

I can't believe how many people on here are so young that they probably don't remember what it was like to live before 9/11. I was 22. The world is so different now. In a lot of ways, I think it brought out the worst of our political parties. 

[Reagan04 658]

19 minutes ago, vcczar said:

 I'd prefer the federal government over my state government (I live in Texas).

I'd probably be more inclined to Libertarianism if I lived in New England, since I trust those state governments. Both parties are sane in that region. It's probably because I live in Texas, with a bunch of Ted Cruz's, that make the concept of Libertarianism quite frightening since the state would have more influence on my life. 

 

1

Listen to this as an MDer I support solid States Rights I don't think your own location should influence that I think Better Stare's Rights is good for the nation, despite in adversely affecting me in Maryland.

[Reagan04 658]

Just now, vcczar said:

I can't believe how many people on here are so young that they probably don't remember what it was like to live before 9/11. I was 22. The world is so different now. In a lot of ways, I think it brought out the worst of our political parties. 

 

I must say that you are half-right, in the 90's America was unrivaled, we were the superpower, we could go invade and be out of their in a weekend and the economy was never better and just kept booming, Al Qaeda wanted to knock us down a peg and that's what they did, they went for the 3 sectors of American Might, the economy with the Twin Towers, Military with the Pentagon, and Government, with either the Capitol Building or the White House.

[Patine 469]

53 minutes ago, servo75 said:

Ok yes I voted for Clinton in 1996 and Gore in 2000.  I plead insanity and a victim of leftist media.   Though I would give Reagan's answer about "the party left me."  Back in the day I considered myself a Center-Left Democrat, was on the fence through the 2000s, but as I started to see the party go toward the SJW and PC nonsense, by 2008 I had enough.  But even in my Michael Dukakis / Bill Clinton days I would have been against the "social justice" "Black Lives Matter" crap.  Funny, as a teen I was staunchly anti-drug, so I've flopped on a lot of things.

I think the way to "convert" liberals, which I know first-hand, is to present them with the facts, and get them to realize that they' really are Libertarian at heart.  As soon as I (reluctantly at first) started listening to right-wing radio circa 2008, I realized, "Hey this actually makes more sense."  It was as simple as that.

I will be perfectly frank. Though usually leaning socially liberal, I think the PC ideal has failed miserably, however. It's become a laughing stock, and the butt of many jokes, a fair number even made by social centrists and even liberals. However, I have listened to right-wing media as well. But I usually find it just leads to my intelligence being insulted by blatant lies, generalizations, manipulations of facts and statistics spun beyond recognition, and even harping on long-debunked ideas. So, forgive me if I DON'T agree with "things suddenly making sense and converting me" like you claim such claptrap does.

[Reagan04 658]

2 minutes ago, Patine said:

But I usually find it just leads to my intelligence being insulted by blatant lies, generalizations, manipulations of facts and statistics spun beyond recognition, and even harping on long-debunked ideas.

 

I totally agree that in certain Radio shows *cough cough* Limbaugh *cough cough*  Liberals are absolutely libeled no 2 ways about it.

[Paulo 0]

I voted in other poll before and in this one, I was between right and far right because both seens like two government dream I voted Right.

[ThePotatoWalrus 471]

2 hours ago, Reagan04 said:

Hmph, you should meet my math teacher, he goes off, luckily for me he is Conservative, but for the Liberals (however few), hoho they are in for a treat!

 

I think you'd like my math teacher. He's a Conservative, he doesn't support Trump, and he's writing in Cruz. He even named his daughter "Reagan", lol.

[Reagan04 658]

Just now, ThePotatoWalrus said:

I think you'd like my math teacher. He's a Conservative, he doesn't support Trump, and he's writing in Cruz. He even named his daughter "Reagan", lol.

My kinda guy!

[ThePotatoWalrus 471]

Just now, Reagan04 said:

My kinda guy!

Yeah, he's pretty chill. He knows I love Rubio, so one time, we were doing shapes and shit, and we were supposed to do circumference and area for circles (it was like, review, idek why we were doing it, we're Sophomores, but I only did circumferences) and he let me off with full credit. He's pretty dank. Lets us curse in his class. Definitely not your stereotypical conservative.