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President Forever - Western States of America


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Have a plan for my next scenario. The premise is this... In 1805 former Vice President Aaron Burr led a successful and bloodless succession of the western territories of the U.S. Aided by a British Royal Navy blockade of the Mississippi River. A young and still weak U.S. was unable to respond. Burr would serve as president until his incapacity from stroke in 1834. Now after five terms 70 year-old President Harry Reid is retiring. What natural born westerner will replace him as President for life?

Below is my list of tentative candidates who were born in the west, and never held an elected office in the United States. I thought this would make for a different set of present day candidates than Romney and Palin. I am also using a circa 1861 map with Idaho, Arizona and Montana not existing yet. Candidates from there will have a different homestate. Any thoughts on who I have not thought of?

Dem

Brian Schweitzer

Brad Henry

Dave Freudenthal

Jerry Brown

Antonio Villaraigosa

Diane Feinstein

Evan Bayh

Amy Klobuchar

Russ Feingold

GOP

John Hoeven

Rick Perry

Jon M. Huntsman, Jr.

Mike Huckabee

Tim Pawlenty

John Thune

Mike Pence

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So, what states are included in this, exactly? Is the basic idea to have something essentially like a U.S. Presidential election, but exclude states that were in the Union in 1804, drawing candidates from only those states? If so, a few thoughts:

Is there a reason to use that 1861 map? Wouldn't it be easy to black out the states you want to exclude from the default map? That's what I usually do when I'm trying to make an election with a subset of U.S. states.

Note that states like Illinois, Texas, Michigan are included in this. So, for instance, George W. Bush or Barack Obama could be eligible. I think you might reasonably want to limit this to continental states west of the Mississippi: WA, OR, CA, ID, NV, AZ, MT, WY, UT, CO, NM, TX, OK, KS, NE, ND, SD, MN, IA, MO, AR, LA. (I guess GWB was born in Connecticut, so that might disqualify him.)

One suggestion for a candidate more explicitly Western: Arnold Schwarzenegger. Sure, he's ineligible to be President of the United States, but after all, this isn't the United States. There's no particular reason why he would be excluded in this country.

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Also, could you try different party names? I feel like there would still be two parties, but that they would at least have substantially different names, or at least one of them would. The Democratic-Republicans existed in 1804 (loosely), but the Democratic Party didn't emerge in the US until Jackson, and the Republicans were a good thirty years later. It would seem reasonable for the United States of Western America (not sure the official title!) to have at least a superficially different political system.

I really, really like this idea though, and I don't want to sound pushy; just my two cents. :)

Also, if you've got Texas and Arizona in the scenario, I'd suggest adding either Kay Bailey Hutchison (somewhat well-known) or Jan Brewer (less so) as possible GOP candidates so you've got a little bit of gender balance on the GOP/conservative side; in our universe, the Western states were a little quicker to give women the vote, so it would follow that there should be a couple women candidates. Other possibilities include Olene Walker (GOP), who was Governor of Utah from '03-05 and Kathleen Blanco (Democrat) who was governor of Louisiana from 03-'07 Again, just my two cents (or does that make it four now?) ;)

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Well very good questions gents, you have certainly made me think about this harder. Assuming I cant use traditional Democrats and Republicans then I will use Democratic-Republican Party and say the Constitutional Union Party (the Constitution of the Western States of America)with elements of the American Party (anti-immigration). I will add Kay Bailey, but not Olene Walker, she is 80! No Governator, 20% approval rating, are you kidding me, he couldnt win a race for dog catcher, same with Blanco. No Brewer she is an accidential governor and not ready for higher office. I like the states I have included and will proceed with my planned map, as I dont imagine the west would have developed exactly the way it did if it secceeded from the US. But will go to plan B if I get frustrated with the different map. I have modified the candidate listing below, thoughts? I think 12 is a lot, however... Any that are not viable for the top spot? Hate to break it to you, but the GOP in this case Constitutional Union is far less gender diverse than the modern day Dems.

Democratic-Republican (Blue)

Brian Schweitzer

Brad Henry

Dave Freudenthal

Jerry Brown

Antonio Villaraigosa

Diane Feinstein

Evan Bayh

Amy Klobuchar

Russ Feingold

John Breaux

Bill White

Lisa Madigan

Constitutional Union/American Party (Orange)

John Hoeven

Rick Perry

Kay Bailey Hutchinson

Jon M. Huntsman, Jr.

Mike Huckabee

Tim Pawlenty

John Thune

Mike Pence

Gary Johnson

Bill Owens

Michele Bachmann

Mike Johanns

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Some I would strike altogether:

Dem-Rep

Antonio Villaraigosa would not be a viable national candidate.

Feinstein is 76 years old

John Breaux just seems really unlikely, so does Klobuchar but I don't object as much to her)

Maybe add a dark horse that's more liberal, like John Kitzhaber, and if you want an old-hand type to replace Breaux/Feinstein you could always look at maybe a Roy Romer or Bruce Babbitt

For the other party, I would replace Hoeven with Kempthorne who is actually rumored to run in RL.

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Wow! Did not realize Di-Fi was such an old dame. I will scratch her for Kitzhaber. However I do not agree about Villaraigosa, in this scenario with just the west he can brag about being in charge of the largest city, while he is not a perfect candidate, he can also vie for the latino vote in states like California, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico/Arizona and Texas, that makes him a factor. Or would Xavier Becerra accomplish the same thing minus the experience of running a big city and marital issues of Villaraigosa. I see Romer or Babbit as no more attractive candidates then Breaux. I wanted the Dem-Rep to have at least one candidate from the southeast. I wanted to have Kempthorne, but just forgot. I will replace Johanns with him since they have virtually the same experience. This list keeps getting better. Considering adding Maria Cantwell and scratching Klobuchar, has more time in Senate and had a stint as a bigtime executive between her service in the house and senate or Madigan who just seems too junior and not high enough for a credible 2010 run for president.

Some I would strike altogether:

Dem-Rep

Antonio Villaraigosa would not be a viable national candidate.

Feinstein is 76 years old

John Breaux just seems really unlikely, so does Klobuchar but I don't object as much to her)

Maybe add a dark horse that's more liberal, like John Kitzhaber, and if you want an old-hand type to replace Breaux/Feinstein you could always look at maybe a Roy Romer or Bruce Babbitt

For the other party, I would replace Hoeven with Kempthorne who is actually rumored to run in RL.

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Wow! Did not realize Di-Fi was such an old dame. I will scratch her for Kitzhaber. However I do not agree about Villaraigosa, in this scenario with just the west he can brag about being in charge of the largest city, while he is not a perfect candidate, he can also vie for the latino vote in states like California, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico/Arizona and Texas, that makes him a factor. Or would Xavier Becerra accomplish the same thing minus the experience of running a big city and marital issues of Villaraigosa. I see Romer or Babbit as no more attractive candidates then Breaux. I wanted the Dem-Rep to have at least one candidate from the southeast. I wanted to have Kempthorne, but just forgot. I will replace Johanns with him since they have virtually the same experience. This list keeps getting better. Considering adding Maria Cantwell and scratching Klobuchar, has more time in Senate and had a stint as a bigtime executive between her service in the house and senate or Madigan who just seems too junior and not high enough for a credible 2010 run for president.

If you're going to scratch one, I'd go with Madigan--she's nowhere near high-profile enough to be viable. She might make a potential VP candidate, but I think that might even be a stretch right now. Cantwell seems like a good choice.

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Okay here is the latest candidate roundup:

Democratic-Republican (Blue)

Brian Schweitzer

Brad Henry

Dave Freudenthal

Jerry Brown

Antonio Villaraigosa

Jihn Kitzhaber

Evan Bayh

Amy Klobuchar

Russ Feingold

John Breaux

Bill White

Maria Cantwell

Constitutional Union/American Party (Orange)

John Hoeven

Rick Perry

Kay Bailey Hutchinson

Jon M. Huntsman, Jr.

Mike Huckabee

Tim Pawlenty

John Thune

Mike Pence

Gary Johnson

Bill Owens

Michele Bachmann

Dirk Kenmpthorne

If you're going to scratch one, I'd go with Madigan--she's nowhere near high-profile enough to be viable. She might make a potential VP candidate, but I think that might even be a stretch right now. Cantwell seems like a good choice.

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I'm not sure if you're looking for VP candidates yet, but if you want some kind of regional balance with southeastern candidates, might I suggest either Sen. Mark Pryor (D-AR) or Mike Beebe (D-AR)? Beebe was only elected Governor in 2006, so I doubt he would be prominent enough for a Presidential run, and Pryor just doesn't seem prominent enough. But they could be useful counterweights to a Pacific coast Democartic nominee.

If you still want to scratch Klobuchar, you could try Sen. Blanche Lincoln: replaces one female Dem-Rep with another, and adds one from the Southeast (Arkansas).

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Yes I am looking for VEEP candidates for both parties. In fact I would like others watching on the forum to nominate some namesas well. I will register a nomination for Beebe, he has an interesting story versus silver spoon Pryor. Her is our very short list, help us add to it. Remember the two criteria, born in the Western States in this scenario (West of Mississippi River+Michigan,Illinois, Indiana, Wisconsin), and never served in an "elective" office in the US States not in the scenario.

Dem-Rep

Mike Beebe

Elizabeth Warren

Constitutional Union/American Party

Tommy Franks

I'm not sure if you're looking for VP candidates yet, but if you want some kind of regional balance with southeastern candidates, might I suggest either Sen. Mark Pryor (D-AR) or Mike Beebe (D-AR)? Beebe was only elected Governor in 2006, so I doubt he would be prominent enough for a Presidential run, and Pryor just doesn't seem prominent enough. But they could be useful counterweights to a Pacific coast Democartic nominee.

If you still want to scratch Klobuchar, you could try Sen. Blanche Lincoln: replaces one female Dem-Rep with another, and adds one from the Southeast (Arkansas).

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I also suggest that alberta, saskatchewan and british coluimbia be part of the WSA, you could add Stephen Harper as a constitutional union candidate. Speaking of washed-up politicians, Gary Hart would be an interesting candidate.

Sorry no Canadian provinces in this scenario. More power to ya though. And yes Gary Hart is washed up, he was washed up in 1988 when I was ten.

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Hart wouldn't be a bad choice though, he's one of the most respected voices on homeland security and foreign policy in Washington, he's still very active in Colorado, and not to mention that most people have largely forgiven him since 1988, to the extent that he was a frontrunner for both Defense and Homeland Security had Kerry won in 2004.

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Okay a nomination for Gary Hart as VEEP it is.

Hart wouldn't be a bad choice though, he's one of the most respected voices on homeland security and foreign policy in Washington, he's still very active in Colorado, and not to mention that most people have largely forgiven him since 1988, to the extent that he was a frontrunner for both Defense and Homeland Security had Kerry won in 2004.

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