Patine 385 Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 This project is meant for the near future, but is meant to compliment England 2015 and Scotland 2015, as well as my own United States 2016 (almost done), United States 2012 and 2020 (just started), Canada 2012 (done, just with an error after the first turn I can't fix), and several other near-future scenarios of mine and others' design. The parties are: Plaid Cyrmu (incumbant) Welsh Labour Party Welsh Conservative Party Welsh Liberal Democratic Party English Unionist Party Welsh Green Party Welsh Integrity Party (Eurosceptics) Welsh National Party Independents I plan to build from the extant Wales 2007 scenario. I will need help with candidates and issues. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 Nice one, i'll help with candidates first. Also as it's for CF, can you please delete the "Regional List AM" seats in the ridings for Wales 2007. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matvail2002 803 Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 Finally! I would have done it myself at a later date. Do you think that English Rights would be better than English Unionists? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 Plaid Cyrmu Jocelyn Davies Ieuan Wyn Jones Dai Lloyd Welsh Labour Party Rosemary Butler Alun Davies Rhodri Morgan Welsh Conservative Party Darren Millar Nicholas Bourne Jonathan Morgan Welsh Liberal Democratic Party Lembit Opik (Moving from MP seat to AM) Mick Bates Peter Black Welsh Green Party Jake Griffiths John Matthews Independents Trish Law Dai Davies (Moving from MP seat to AM) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 Note: After Welsh independence, the Welsh Assembly would be upgraded to a parliament,or a new parliament would be built. Doesn't have to be called "Welsh Parliament", perhaps Cymru Parliament or the name can be more obscure such as Cardiff or placename in Cardiff in a similar vein to Westminster, but just suggestions. Note in reference to previous post: Ignore "AM" the new initial could be MWP (member of Welsh Parliament or whatever) Issues (in no order): Former UK Relations Monarchy Welsh Language Economic Recovery Industry Restructure (Referring to Welsh wanting to be more self-sufficient, re-opening old coal mines closed in the 80's by Thatcher's government as imported energy rises in price gradual but continuous) Environment NHS Europe Conflict of Laws - (England & Wales have a "conflict of laws", this means that both countries share similar or exact same laws, the question of whether to maintain this situation, or become a seperate entity) Unemployment Pensions Tax & Budget Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted September 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2009 These candidates and issues are great, Treasurer! Thanks greatly! I think I'll go with Cyrmu Parliament, and thus 'MCP' for members. I'm thinking it'll have been a Plaid Cymru/Welsh Lib Dem/Green coalition to take power from what would have otherwise have been a Labour minority government, with a small Conservative caucus, going into independence in (I believe the England 2015 scenario said) 2014. Shortly thereafter, the coalition falls apart, leading to the 2015 election. BTW, do you know of any Welsh politicians who could possibly stand in as potential leaders of an English Unionist, Welsh National, and Welsh Integrity (my hypothetical name for Eurosceptics) Party, even if only one leader for each? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matvail2002 803 Posted September 24, 2009 Report Share Posted September 24, 2009 Frankly, two things that I find that seems not to be working well with the Wales 2015 scenario: -The lack of a Constitutional Assembly to draft a constitution. -The problem with some parties orientations and issues positions, because I don't think that Plaid (like the SNP) could really survive with their main goal achieved because they have some left-wing and right-wing elements in the party. So, I think that Plaid could maybe have only 15-20% of the vote as the more left/right elements have gone to Labour, the Lib Dems or the Conservatives (especially in rural areas). So, logically we can say that Wales had adopted the Euro as currency? Also, is the Welsh language is much used by people in major cities, such as Cardiff? Also, is there are some unilingual Welsh speakers that don't speak English in some more remote rural areas of Wales? (Is a sign law imposing Welsh on commercial signs is feasible? These could make some part of your Welsh language issue) Treasurer, many countries have the National Assembly name for their lower house parliament (comes orginally from the French National Assembly). However, I think that the National Assembly could of course part of the Cymru Parliament. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matvail2002 803 Posted September 24, 2009 Report Share Posted September 24, 2009 BTW, do you know of any Welsh politicians who could possibly stand in as potential leaders of an English Unionist, Welsh National, and Welsh Integrity (my hypothetical name for Eurosceptics) Party, even if only one leader for each? For the Welsh National Party, these were the members of the BNP list in the last Euro election: Ennys Hughes, Laurence Read, Clive Bennett, Kevin Edwards. Furthermore, the BNP has a good score (about 4,3%) at the last Welsh election. John Bufton is Wales Eurosceptic UKIP member in the European Parliament. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted September 24, 2009 Report Share Posted September 24, 2009 Good answer for possible English Unionist candidate. Ed Abrams, an English Democrat, has stood in a Welsh Assembly election and for a Welsh constituency for Westminster as well as in England (Chester). Andrew Constantine and Mike Blundell, featured in 2007 WA elections, also English Democrats, could also be candidates. Can be skewed to appear more unionist of course. It would be possible for Wales to adopt the Euro, which would depends on the strength of the Pound and how much pressure the EU would extort. Without money/subsidies coming from Westminster, Wales might struggle unless they re-strengthened previous industries, so it may be forced upon them in a referendum on the Euro. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted September 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 25, 2009 The candidates are great, Treasurer and matvail! As for the Euro, I'm assuming Wales is pressured into accepting that currency, and that their economic ties to England are as frosty as their diplomatic ones. As for Plaid Cymru, it seems from what I can gather they do better than 15-20% in Assembly elections, though maybe not in the Westminister ones, so I will continue to assume a Plaid Cymru/Welsh Lib Dem coalition going into independence that breaks up over some issue, leading to the election. I will likely use National Assembly for the lower house of the Cymru Parliament (and maybe also, although not relevant to the scenario, National Council for the upper house). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted September 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 I am going to need party logos for all of the parties (except maybe Plaid Cymru, which could get away with keeping it's 2007 logo), especially the Welsh National, Welsh Integrity, and English Unionist Parties. Any chance you could help me out when you have a spare moment, Treasurer? No rush. Like Japan, this is a near future, not currently active, project (South Guanjin, Hutali, and United States 1936 are my current projects). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Certainly. What are the colours of your minor parties? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted October 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Certainly. What are the colours of your minor parties? I'd say dark-blue for the Welsh National Party and purple for the Welsh Integrity Party, like their modern British counterparts. And maybe light-blue for the English Unionists, like the Unionists in you and GOP Progressive's Scotland 2015 scenario. Not overly original, but practical and realistic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted October 5, 2009 Report Share Posted October 5, 2009 Tell me if the logos are too dragon-y. Like them? If you need help with anything else for Wales, just PM me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted October 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2009 Tell me if the logos are too dragon-y. Like them? If you need help with anything else for Wales, just PM me. These look awesome! Could I just humbly ask one more thing? Could you put the Plaid Cymru logo in this format? The version I have is in the rectangle superimposed on the grid format. If you could, that'd be great! Thanks a lot! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted October 6, 2009 Report Share Posted October 6, 2009 Ah, you mean my version of the logos? Yes, just made a Plaid one with the right dimensions for you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted October 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2009 Ah, you mean my version of the logos? Yes, just made a Plaid one with the right dimensions for you. This is great, Treasurer! Thanks a lot! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted April 20, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2010 I'm thinking of taking this one up again for a K4E project, especially with Treasurer's return. This scenario will be followed by Japan 2009. A few things to note. -I reread your last post on this matvail, and see I didn't quite read it properly last time when I responded. I understand that, as a nationalist party that had achieved independence, Plaid Cymru had largely achieved it's purpose and, if they chose to run further, given their somewhat divided platform, they'd probably lose votes to the left and right. I see this now, and thus will probably have them both consolidate a more solid platform just to remain viable in the new political environment, and be polling significantly less than today. -I see a Constitutional Convention, which matvail asked about, having been planned for the near future, but the collapse of the governing coalition has delayed it until after the election. It will likely be an issue, though. -I do still see Wales pressured to adopt the euro shortly after independence, though the Welsh Integrity Party will be gunning for the creation of a "Welsh pound," or a patriated currency. Any further suggestions and comments are welcome. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matvail2002 803 Posted April 21, 2010 Report Share Posted April 21, 2010 Will this be released with Scotland-2015? So, I guess with a weaker Plaid, we must basically look at the urban (Liberal Democratic/Labour) vs. former industrial areas (Labour) vs. rural (Conservative) divide to see to see the main parties. This added to the fact that the English Unionist Party could have quite a few seats near the English border and the other parties will hover around the threshold. Also, for C4E, could you enter a function or command to lower the threshold to put it at 2-3%. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted April 21, 2010 Report Share Posted April 21, 2010 Will this be released with Scotland-2015? It would be cool if both were released at the same time. I will get to Scotland 2015 soon enough, and I can help more with Wales. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted April 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2010 A few more notes to consider before assembling a complete list of issues. -Treasurer, is there a nuclear power plant or two in Wales, and if so, where? I thought it might be flavourful to state them by location in an Environment issue if there's only one or two (notably to demand their closure at Left), like the one at Sellafield is mentioned in the Northern Ireland Assembly 2007 scenario in such a like, but if there's more than one (which would surprise me), then I'll just say 'all nuclear plants.' -I imagine in late 2014 the Welsh government negotiated but didn't ratify a deal to purchase jet fighters from Sweden to beef up a repatriated armed forces. The coalition collapsed before the deal could be sealed. This could be part of a Repatriated Armed Forces or some such issue. -I would see, given the lack of major viable income outside taxes, coal (which most developed countries don't want, leaving poor Third World buyers), and tourism, some of the more right-wing parties, like the Welsh Conservative, Welsh National, and Welsh Integrity Parties, and even, strapped for options in the long-term, Plaid Cyrmu, campaign on privatizing many government services long taken for granted as public, whereas the Welsh Labour, Welsh Liberal Democratic, and the Welsh Green Parties fight for public ownership. The English Unionist Party, despite being quite right-wing, don't push for privatization at all; they say reunion with England will solve the problem of funds needed for such services (maybe the C stance). -The actual constitution was never drafted, as the Constitutional Convention never was assembled before the coalition collapsed. They did rename the Welsh National Assembly the Cyrmu Parliament and appointed a Governor-General to stand in for the monarch, but a Constitition issue will cover such ground as whether the Cymru Parliament will remane MMP or become FPTP like England, whether it will have one or two houses, and, if two, what the upper house will be like and how it's members decided, whether they'll retain the monarchy (and thus try to grow back closer to England) or instead elect a President, and whether they'll have judicial review of Cymru Parliment acts or not. Some ideas for now. Tell me what you think. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted April 22, 2010 Report Share Posted April 22, 2010 I'm not aware of the nuclear plant situation in Wales, but I checked and it seems you are right about there being 1 nuclear power plant, as the other one is closed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_power_stations_in_Wales I like the sound of the privitisation issue, and a Plaid party endorsing it, and the English Unionists are not. Monarchy and Constitution could be 2 different issues. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patine 385 Posted April 23, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2010 Current list of issues is as follows: Armed Forces Repatriation Conflict of Laws Constitution Economic Recovery Environment Europe Former UK Relations Industry Restructure Monarchy NHS Pensions Privatization Tax & Budget Unemployment Welsh Language I just need three more. Any suggestions? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matvail2002 803 Posted April 23, 2010 Report Share Posted April 23, 2010 Rural development vs. Cities could also be an issue. Also, could immigration be an issue? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Treasurer 28 Posted April 24, 2010 Report Share Posted April 24, 2010 Immigration should be in I think, but on a low profile (1 or 2) for Wales. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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