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vcczar

Rating Ted Kennedy

Rating Sen. Ted Kennedy  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Read my first comment below to see Kennedy's career: How would you rate his career as a US Senator?

  2. 2. Would Ted Kennedy have made a better president than Carter or Reagan?

    • Yes, better than both Carter and Reagan
    • Better than Carter but not Reagan
    • Better than Reagan but not Carter
    • No, worse than both
  3. 3. How will Ted Kennedy most likely be remembered?

    • The Liberal Lion of the Senate for the late 20th/early 21st century
    • The Kennedy brother that wasn't JFK or RFK (even though he arguably accomplished more than both of them combined)
    • Chappaquiddick
    • Failing in his bid for the 1980 Democratic Nomination against incumbent President Jimmy Carter
      0


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Same as with my McCain and Gingrich threads. Kennedy has 23 actions, which is more than McCain or Gingrich:

Kennedy, Edward 90 S D MA 1968 1968 1 move to draft him at Demo convention                
Kennedy, Edward 91 S D MA 1969 1969 2 bridge accident at Chappaquiddick                
Kennedy, Edward 91 S D MA 1969 1969 3 elected Demo party whip                
Kennedy, Edward 93 S D MA 1973 1973 4 grills L. Patrick Gray re Watergate                
Kennedy, Edward 95 S D MA 1978 1978 5 bitter fight with pres re nat health insurance                
Kennedy, Edward 95 S D MA 1978 1978 6 drafts hospital cost containment bill                
Kennedy, Edward 95 S D MA 1978 1978 7 calls final energy bill a monstrosity                
Kennedy, Edward 95 S D MA 1978 1978 8 attacks Carter at midterm party conference                
Kennedy, Edward 96 S D MA 1980 1980 9 challenges Carter from the left                
Kennedy, Edward 96 S D MA 1980 1980 10 resonant liberal speech at Demo convention                
Kennedy, Edward 100 S D MA 1987 1987 11 leads fight vs. Bork nomination                
Kennedy, Edward 101 S D MA 1988 1990 12 Negotiated and directed passage of Am w/ Disabilities Act                
Kennedy, Edward 101 S D MA 1989 1990 13 Introduc Immigration Act of 1990                
Kennedy, Edward 102 S D MA 1991 1991 14 Negotiated w/ GOP and Southern Dems to push through passage of Civ Rights A of 1991                
Kennedy, Edward 103 S D MA 1994 1994 15 First US Senator to have home page on the WWW                
Kennedy, Edward 104 S D MA 1995 1996 16 Leads push for first minimum wage increase in ages                
Kennedy, Edward 104 S D MA 1996 1996 17 Namesake of Kennedy-Kassenbaum Health Insurance Act                
Kennedy, Edward 105 S D MA 1998 1998 18 Added a major staffer to help boost Clinton's legal defense team during impeachment                
Kennedy, Edward 107 S D MA 2001 2002 19 Co-authors No Child Left Behind                
Kennedy, Edward 107 S D MA 2002 2002 20 Broke w/ majority of his party by opposing Iraq War Resolution.                
Kennedy, Edward 110 S D MA 2007 2007 21 Negotiated w/ GOP and helped lead on Comprehinsive Immigration Reform (Kennedy-Kyl)                
Kennedy, Edward 110 S D MA 2008 2008 22 Crucial endorsement of Obama prior to Super Tuesday swung support away from H Clinton                
Kennedy, Edward 111 S D MA 2009 2009 23 Made tie-breaking vote to kill the fillibust on Obama Stimulus Package                

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Was a toss up for me between Chappaquiddick and being the third Kennedy brother. 

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15 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

Was a toss up for me between Chappaquiddick and being the third Kennedy brother. 

I went with 3rd Kennedy brother. I think that recent movie about Chappaquiddick kind of reminded a lot of people about it. It's easy to occasionally forget about Chappaquiddick, but it's almost impossible to forget his brothers are JFK and RFK. That was my rationale. 

I also gave him the vote of great, because I think he did the best he could for liberal (and occasionally progressive) causes for the time he was most active. The New Deal era of Liberalism was over, and the ensuing Reagan Revolution inaugurated an era of New Democrats like Hart and B Clinton and Gore. He died just as the tide was turning towards an ideology closer to Kennedy's own with Obama's inauguration. 

It's also interesting that he kind of took awhile to get started. It took him over 10 years to do anything consequential, if you exclude attempts to draft him as president and the Chappaquiddick episode. Reacting to Jimmy Carter's presidency seemed to wake him up. 

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There's a book called the Lion of the Senate that is a biography of Ted Kennedy, its a good read.

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7 minutes ago, vcczar said:

I went with 3rd Kennedy brother. I think that recent movie about Chappaquiddick kind of reminded a lot of people about it. It's easy to occasionally forget about Chappaquiddick, but it's almost impossible to forget his brothers are JFK and RFK. That was my rationale. 

I also gave him the vote of great, because I think he did the best he could for liberal (and occasionally progressive) causes for the time he was most active. The New Deal era of Liberalism was over, and the ensuing Reagan Revolution inaugurated an era of New Democrats like Hart and B Clinton and Gore. He died just as the tide was turning towards an ideology closer to Kennedy's own with Obama's inauguration. 

It's also interesting that he kind of took awhile to get started. It took him over 10 years to do anything consequential, if you exclude attempts to draft him as president and the Chappaquiddick episode. Reacting to Jimmy Carter's presidency seemed to wake him up. 

What I find notable, on a slight tangent, but since you mentioned them, is that Bill Clinton and Al Gore seemed a lot more Centrist as President and Vice President, respectively, and certainly as Governor and Senator respectively, and became FAR more known for Liberal and Progressive causes (and Green causes, for Gore) with their NGO's, philanthropy, and other private citizen's initiatives, after leaving the White House.

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4 minutes ago, Patine said:

What I find notable, on a slight tangent, but since you mentioned them, is that Bill Clinton and Al Gore seemed a lot more Centrist as President and Vice President, respectively, and certainly as Governor and Senator respectively, and became FAR more known for Liberal and Progressive causes (and Green causes, for Gore) with their NGO's, philanthropy, and other private citizen's initiatives, after leaving the White House.

That's not unusual. Same thing happened for Carter. Biden is more liberal now than he was as VP, and was more liberal as VP than he was as Senator. I think it has a lot to do with how much free will they have. If you have to be elected and reelected, then you have to cater to people if you want to win (in most cases). Post-presidency, you can kind of do whatever you want and be your real self. Carter's shift is probably the most extreme from Gov to Post-Presidency. Then I'd say Gore's. Then Clinton's. Then Biden's. Obama has been so quiet in his post-presidency that it's hard to say if he's shifted. He might be the only one that moved somewhat right when he became president. 

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I'm open to suggestions for the next US Senator or US Rep that we rate. Make sure it's someone that has had some significance between 1788- present. 

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16 minutes ago, vcczar said:

I'm open to suggestions for the next US Senator or US Rep that we rate. Make sure it's someone that has had some significance between 1788- present. 

Orrin Hatch?

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3 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

Orrin Hatch?

I could probably do him. I think he'll have few "actions" as I think he almost always followed the party line and made few autonomous or consequential moves. 

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44 minutes ago, vcczar said:

I'm open to suggestions for the next US Senator or US Rep that we rate. Make sure it's someone that has had some significance between 1788- present. 

John Glenn? 

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8 minutes ago, Dr. Insano said:

John Glenn? 

Good idea. I'll wait to see all the proposals and then see if Hatch or Glenn are worth doing. 

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50 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

Orrin Hatch?

 

23 minutes ago, Dr. Insano said:

John Glenn? 

Both Hatch and Glenn have too few actions. Hatch has 3 and Glenn only 1. While influential for their times, they weren't routinely consequential and/or autonomous. Glenn's only action is a bid for president. Hatch's are a bid for president, being a critical factor in getting Justice Thomas through confirmation, and opposing his party in having MX missiles in Utah. 

Feel free to propose other statesmen. 

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2 minutes ago, vcczar said:

 

Both Hatch and Glenn have too few actions. Hatch has 3 and Glenn only 1. While influential for their times, they weren't routinely consequential and/or autonomous. Glenn's only action is a bid for president. Hatch's are a bid for president, being a critical factor in getting Justice Thomas through confirmation, and opposing his party in having MX missiles in Utah. 

Feel free to propose other statesmen. 

George W. Norris or William Jennings Bryan? 

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2 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

George W. Norris or William Jennings Bryan? 

Ok, I can do those. 

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14 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

George W. Norris or William Jennings Bryan? 

 

11 minutes ago, vcczar said:

Ok, I can do those. 

I swear, William Jennings Bryan must have found something growing wild in the fields of the quaint country origin he proudly came from and politically promoted for that he was smoking a lot of...

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2 minutes ago, Patine said:

 

I swear, William Jennings Bryan must have found something growing wild in the fields of the quaint country origin he proudly came from and politically promoted for that he was smoking a lot of...

?? I'm not following. I mean I get the implication, but I'm not following why you are implying that about WJB?

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22 minutes ago, SilentLiberty said:

?? I'm not following. I mean I get the implication, but I'm not following why you are implying that about WJB?

His policies seemed to be to me quite unusual and extreme - and greatly hyperbolic. Like many on these forums perjoratively accuse me of being - but instead addressing agrarian interests and his take on Christian morality instead.

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7 minutes ago, Patine said:

His policies seemed to be to me quite unusual and extreme - and greatly hyperbolic. Like many on these forums perjoratively accuse me of being - but instead addressing agrarian interests and his take on Christian morality instead.

He definitely has an odd progressive legacy when contrasted with progressivism today. He would rank low in regards to pro-science and pro-civil rights for minorities. However, he'd get high marks in general for progressive reform elsewhere--for the poor, for labor, ant-war, and reforms regarding popular democracy and anti-corruption, anti-monopoly, etc. 

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