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vcczar

1st & 2nd Democrat Debate Poll

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So throughout the two nights I watched with some people you know force the debates on them for their own good hahaha and through out the two nights here was the candidate of choice for them. Night one: Elizabeth Warren, Tulsi Gabbard, Amy Klobuchar Night two: Bernie Sanders, John Hickenlooper, Joe Biden, Joe Biden, John Hickenlooper(mine)

 

1. Who won the debate and why? Kamala Harris, she was the memorable, seemed like the most ready to try to go against Trump, 

2. Who lost the debate and why? I think it's a toss up between Biden, Williamson, and Bennet. I don't think a 'loss' would hurt Biden so to speak as much as the other two, but he held true to being 'obama's wingman' and 'uncle joe'. Williamson was the most searched canidadate but it seemed to me that she looked a little lost at times and she came across to me as awkward. Bennet I think needs to be a bit more relaxed. 

3. Who had the best one-liner? I don't think there was one really, neither night really did though honestly, and between the two I don't think there was even though I still think the first one's was Klobuchar's comment about the three women on stage.

4. Who was the most gaffe prone? I don't think anyone. Maybe Williamson.

5. Who was the most specific and organized? Yang.

6. Who was the most personable/likable? Hickenlooper, even without bias he seemed to me the most to want to work with everyone and also seemed like he'd be down to drink a beer after getting that policy done. I think Yang also is pretty charismatic while being personable.

7. Who was the least personable/likable? Harris was kind of in your face at times, which was to her benefit in some ways but she wasn't likable doing it. Bernie was kind of just on it tonight both offensive and defensive, to his credit I think he got his policy in there as well.

8. Who was the most presidential? Kirsten Gillibrand.

9. Who would be the hardest for Trump to beat in a debate? None of them.

10. Has your opinion changed on any of the candidates? Bennet lost me a bit and Swalwell I think I may have been to hard on. No real drastic changes though.

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5 hours ago, vcczar said:

How so?

Because I don't see any substantiv reason why so many people on this forum hate her so much. 

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1.Harris,Bernie,Buttigieg in this order

2.Biden,he wasnt awful but this is his worst public performance in a while.Yang and Wiliamson sounded like lunatics

3."People dont want foodfight they want food on the table"-Kamala

4.Biden saying that first thing he would do as President is defeat Donald Trump?!That doesnt make any sense!

5.Kamala

6.Well i have a soft spot for him so i might be biased but Bernie.

7.Bennet

8.Pete

9.Kamala and Bernie

10.My opinion of Biden has continued its downfall,and my opinion of Kamala has slightly increased.

 

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Easily the worst performance I’ve seen from Bernie.  He had virtually 1 line he repeated over and over.  And showed little ability to engage in a multi level conversation.  His advantages in a head to head format where he shows sharp contrast, is completely wiped away with so many people on stage.  His lane is not his anymore and he’s shown little ability to give us Bernie 2.0.  Simply amazed how uncompetitive he’s become.  He’s like that all-star pitcher who gets a big contract and goes 4-15 the next year. 

Hes the political version of Los Del Rio

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Bernie's closing statement capped a terrible night for him.  Someone who's been in congress the last 30 years shouldn't be raising the question of why so little has gotten done during that time. 

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This is for those that end up watching the debate. This poll will be in the thread. Copy+paste this to respond. Do this once for the Wed debate and one for the Thurs debate  

1. Who won the debate and why?

Harris for her aggressive attack on Biden

2. Who lost the debate and why?

Williamson for her nonsensical rambling answers involving calling the PM of New Zealand.

3. Who had the best one-liner?

I honestly cannot think of one.

4. Who was the most gaffe prone?

Not really a gaffe, but Williams entire performance was...odd.

5. Who was the most specific and organized?

I feel Gillibrand was organized.

6. Who was the most personable/likable?

Gillibrand 

7. Who was the least personable/likable?

Thats a tough one, and just say Williamson

8. Who was the most presidential?

Harris and possibly Biden

9. Who would be the hardest for Trump to beat in a debate?

Easily Harris. Though I would pay good money for him to debate Williamson.

10. Has your opinion changed on any of the candidates. 

Not entirely. 

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1. Who won the debate and why?
Harris, without a doubt. She commanded the stage the entirety of the debate.

2. Who lost the debate and why?

I'd say a tie between Biden and Williamson. Biden just because he has more to lose, and Harris laid into him pretty hard. Williamson has little to lose and therefore likely didn't lose as much.

3. Who had the best one-liner?

Harris with the food on the table remark.

4. Who was the most gaffe prone?

Biden stumbled into a states' rights defense, but Williamson was just confusing. No real gaffes were that present.

5. Who was the most specific and organized?

Gillibrand obviously knew what she was talking about.

6. Who was the most personable/likable?

Hmm...None were all that likable to me, but if I have to pick, I'd go Gillibrand or Hickenlooper.

7. Who was the least personable/likable?

Bernie isn't the most likable person to begin with, and this debate just cemented that for me. He seemed angry when he didn't need to be.

8. Who was the most presidential?

Gillibrand, Hickenlooper

9. Who would be the hardest for Trump to beat in a debate?

Harris, by far. I think she can take on Trump the best of any candidate on that stage.

10. Has your opinion changed on any of the candidates. 

Harris has moved up into a tie for number 1 with Warren. Her performance was beyond amazing. Swalwel, Gillibrand, and Hickenlooper had decent performances, but none enough to change what I would say.

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Yang had the least time speaking at the 2nd debate. I would say he lost the most opportunity, but he's now claiming NBC cut his mic. So who knows how this will affect his candidacy.

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In democratic eyes : Kamala and Buttigieg won as well as some underdogs candidate

In my eyes : Every dem been "meh" but Biden been awfull in his first debate, he litteraly admitted his campain is essentially to beat Trump, so opinions polls would be his only legitimacy

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It's just one debate, but Bernie seems outclassed-outmaneuvered to me. In a field with just him and Hillary, he could outright win primaries. I wouldn't be surprised if Warren, Buttigieg, and perhaps others pick up more and more of his supporters. 

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Sanders seems done indeed

His mod with teenagers seems to have past, now Buttigieg Kamala and essentially Warren are taking his electorate

Kamala and Buttigieg are essentially 2 candidates that can win the nomination because of the enthousiasm behind their campain.

Warren has become widely popular she turns around 15% 1 poll on 2 she's second behind Biden, it's incredible how strong is the honeymoon between her campain and the democrats.

But for me only Biden an Beto could beat Trump in southern states like North Carolina, Texas, Florida or Arizona

Sanders would surely do well but more in the North (Ohio, Michigan, Pennsilvania) and less in the South

Harris that would be tougher but possible just like Buttigieg, narrow but potential race

Warren I claim Trump would do a larger victory (between 330 and 360) in great electors with maybe a higher percentage

Democrats don't have to forget the political situation is now so divided that a lot of key states will be decided in suburbs of great cities.

Because both parties admitted their traditionnal territories with their policies (Cities for Dems countrysides for Rep).

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The consensus appears to me to be something like ... First debate winner: Castro and Warren (tie). First debate loser: Beto. Second debate winner: Harris. Second debate loser: Biden and Bernie (tie).

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Would be great if CNN could up the debate requirements for July. Having 10 candidates on stage is just too many. Splitting them up into two nights means you miss lots of opportunities for more meaningful policy debates or contrasts. For example, is Warren or Bernie the better choice for voter A? Would be great to have them contrasted side by side.

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@admin_270

What did you think of Williamson’s performance?

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16 minutes ago, admin_270 said:

Would be great if CNN could up the debate requirements for July. Having 10 candidates on stage is just too many. Splitting them up into two nights means you miss lots of opportunities for more meaningful policy debates or contrasts. For example, is Warren or Bernie the better choice for voter A? Would be great to have them contrasted side by side.

So, have CNN gain part of the marginalization of candidates power institutionally that corrupt Party Machines already exercise with impunity? How rigged, unfair, and stacked does the U.S. - whose Department of State has the temerity to scold "emerging democracies" for such flawed, broken, corrupt, and rigged elections - have to drive it's own electoral system, and any reputation it may have once had for Constitutional governance and a government "of the people, by the people, and for the people,' down into the mud?

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It's still too early to narrow the field very much.  We're still more than seven months from Iowa.  At this point four years ago, Donald Trump was polling at >1% and widely considered a joke (if he was considered at all).

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20 minutes ago, vcczar said:

@admin_270

What did you think of Williamson’s performance?

Very little time. She was Williamson, and relative to her time, had a pretty good impact. If someone doesn't buy that a more spiritual leader can beat Trump, they aren't going to support Williamson, I think. This to me is the big question.

I had to do a double-take when I saw Williamson trending on Twitter after the debate - it gave her a boost of exposure, will probably energize her supporters, and who knows? She might even gain some more traction.

She also got some press. 

https://time.com/5616722/marianne-williamson-2020-democratic-debate/

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/marianne-williamson-gains-attention-heated-democratic-debate-unique/story?id=64009512

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/marianne-williamson-wont-make-you-feel-better-about-america-but-youll-feel-better-about-yourself/2019/06/26/26174e10-9372-11e9-aadb-74e6b2b46f6a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.64a9bd629549

for examples.

So I think it was probably a good night for her. Like with Yang, she has a niche, but I have to wonder about her percentage ceiling in the broader electorate.

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28 minutes ago, Patine said:

So, have CNN gain part of the marginalization of candidates power institutionally that corrupt Party Machines already exercise with impunity?

Yes, exactly.

;)

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28 minutes ago, pilight said:

At this point four years ago, Donald Trump was polling at >1% and widely

Not quite right. By late June of 2015, Trump was second in the polling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationwide_opinion_polling_for_the_2016_Republican_Party_presidential_primaries

Two weeks later, he was in first, and would hold that position for the rest of the primaries.

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1 minute ago, admin_270 said:

Very little time. She was Williamson, and relative to her time, had a pretty good impact. If someone doesn't buy that a more spiritual leader can beat Trump, they aren't going to support Williamson, I think. This to me is the big question.

I had to do a double-take when I saw Williamson trending on Twitter after the debate - it gave her a boost of exposure, will probably energize her supporters, and who knows? She might even gain some more traction.

She also got some press. 

https://time.com/5616722/marianne-williamson-2020-democratic-debate/

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/marianne-williamson-gains-attention-heated-democratic-debate-unique/story?id=64009512

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/marianne-williamson-wont-make-you-feel-better-about-america-but-youll-feel-better-about-yourself/2019/06/26/26174e10-9372-11e9-aadb-74e6b2b46f6a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.64a9bd629549

for examples.

So I think it was probably a good night for her. Like with Yang, she has a niche, but I have to wonder about her percentage ceiling in the broader electorate.

Yeah I think she will energize the 1% that support her, but I think she had one of the worst debate performances of any debater I’ve ever seen that didn’t technically commit a gaffe. She was rarely specific, often hard to follow, and came off loonier than Michelle Bachman, the latter who at least seemed to be talking politics. 

I doubt she bumps higher than 2% and I don’t think she’ll make many more debates. I bet her unfavorability goes sky high. 

She showed almost no issue knowledge. The charisma that I heard that she’s supposed to have never showed up. She wasn’t a skilled debater in the least. This said, it’s only the first time I’ve seen her speak, so I’ll give her another chance. Maybe she was on pain killers and vodka last night. 

I actually think she’d get more support for faith based Republicans who aren’t too conservative than she would from even spiritual Democrats. 

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2 minutes ago, vcczar said:

I doubt she bumps higher than 2% and I don’t think she’ll make many more debates.

On to the next round!

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12 minutes ago, admin_270 said:

On to the next round!

Who are we predicting makes it to round 2? Here are mine:

Biden, Sanders, Warren, Buttigieg, Harris, Beto, Booker, Castro, Yang, and Gabbard. 

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30 minutes ago, Herbert Hoover said:

Who are we predicting makes it to round 2? Here are mine:

Biden, Sanders, Warren, Buttigieg, Harris, Beto, Booker, Castro, Yang, and Gabbard. 

Has the DNC said only 10 candidates will make it to the second round? I was still hoping Gravel could steal Williamson’s or one of the other candidates’ spots. 

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