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Let's say you're right, and it's an egregious mistake. What do you think follows from the author of Hebrews mischaracterizing a psalm?

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10 minutes ago, admin_270 said:

Let's say you're right, and it's an egregious mistake. What do you think follows from the author of Hebrews mischaracterizing a psalm?

Aside from casting doubts on his reliability or if he's citing the septugaint it's reliability not much.

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I'm a bit of a wreck right now basically realizing that due to the non-existence of the soul we're all basically a bunch of chemicals which combine for sentience; all that will happen and has is determined due to physical cause-and-effect and my inability to believe in the unbelievable and unprovable which as per Clifford is "one long sin against mankind."

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38 minutes ago, DebateGod said:

I'm a bit of a wreck right now basically realizing that due to the non-existence of the soul we're all basically a bunch of chemicals which combine for sentience; all that will happen and has is determined due to physical cause-and-effect and my inability to believe in the unbelievable and unprovable which as per Clifford is "one long sin against mankind."

lmao you have a bad trip too?

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1 minute ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

lmao you have a bad trip too?

Happy is the man who has not followed the counsel of the wicked, or taken the path of sinners, or joined the company of scorners. - Psalms 1:1

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1 minute ago, DebateGod said:

Happy is the man who has not followed the counsel of the wicked, or taken the path of sinners, or joined the company of scorners. - Psalms 1:1

Words to live by especially the last part.

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2 minutes ago, DebateGod said:

Happy is the man who has not followed the counsel of the wicked, or taken the path of sinners, or joined the company of scorners. - Psalms 1:1

You good fam?

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Since this is the philosophy thread I figured I'd post my proof that free will can't exist without the supernatural

Premise A:  All physical states must somehow be caused

Premise B: The brain and its processes are physical

Conclusion 1: The brain's mechanisms must be caused in a physical manner

Premise A: From the principle of alternate possibilities we know than an agent can't be held responsible for an action if he couldn't have chosen otherwise

Premise B : Frankfurt cases will never apply as beliefs and wants are caused by brain states which are in turn physical states (and from conclusion 1) must be caused

Premise C (From conclusion 1) If all brain states are physical and hence must be caused then we, the agents, couldn't have chosen otherwise and can't be held responsible for those choices.

Conclusion 2: If the physical world is all that exists free will is impossible.

Premise A: (From conclusion 2) since free will is impossible in a solely physical world something non-physical, an unmoved mover of sorts would have to account for it

Premise B: Since such a mover can't be physical it'd have to be supernatural.

Premise C : And that supernatural would account for free will

Conclusion 3: Free will is impossible in a solely physical world, but is possible if a spiritual world exists.

@LegolasRedbard @Conservative Elector 2

 @vcczar @Patine @WVProgressive @Reagan04 @ThePotatoWalrus

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2 hours ago, NYrepublican said:

Since this is the philosophy thread I figured I'd post my proof that free will can't exist without the supernatural

Premise A:  All physical states must somehow be caused

Premise B: The brain and its processes are physical

Conclusion 1: The brain's mechanisms must be caused in a physical manner

Premise A: From the principle of alternate possibilities we know than an agent can't be held responsible for an action if he couldn't have chosen otherwise

Premise B : Frankfurt cases will never apply as beliefs and wants are caused by brain states which are in turn physical states (and from conclusion 1) must be caused

Premise C (From conclusion 1) If all brain states are physical and hence must be caused then we, the agents, couldn't have chosen otherwise and can't be held responsible for those choices.

Conclusion 2: If the physical world is all that exists free will is impossible.

Premise A: (From conclusion 2) since free will is impossible in a solely physical world something non-physical, an unmoved mover of sorts would have to account for it

Premise B: Since such a mover can't be physical it'd have to be supernatural.

Premise C : And that supernatural would account for free will

Conclusion 3: Free will is impossible in a solely physical world, but is possible if a spiritual world exists.

@LegolasRedbard @Conservative Elector 2

 @vcczar @Patine @WVProgressive @Reagan04 @ThePotatoWalrus

Why did you tag me?

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Just now, ThePotatoWalrus said:

Anybody want to play Chess? I've been trying to learn it and want to challenge some members here. (Especially @Patine)

I'll play you

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Just now, ThePotatoWalrus said:

Anybody want to play Chess? I've been trying to learn it and want to challenge some members here. (Especially @Patine)

I played Chess for a number of years sometime ago. I came to find it boring after a while.

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3 minutes ago, Patine said:

Why did you tag me?

What's the issue? I just want feedback.

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1 minute ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

You want white or black? White goes first.

White send me a link to play you.

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7 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

What's the issue? I just want feedback.

You must have missed a couple of things I've said in the last few days.

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23 minutes ago, Patine said:

I played Chess for a number of years sometime ago. I came to find it boring after a while.

You wanna play now? The game with me and @NYrepublican ended in a stalemate, despite him only having a king and me having a queen, and bishop. Just tell me what color you want and we can go.

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Just now, ThePotatoWalrus said:

You wanna play now? The game with me and @NYrepublican ended in a stalemate, despite him only having a king and me having a queen, and bishop. Just tell me what color you want and we can go.

No, I don't. And I have to go in short bit even if I did.

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1 minute ago, Patine said:

No, I don't. And I have to go in short bit even if I did.

F. Hope you have a safe and productive day my man. Best wishes bud.

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3 hours ago, NYrepublican said:

Premise A:  All physical states must somehow be caused

This is an interesting premise, because it entails that there is a non-physical originating cause.

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So, I think a physicalist would have to deny this premise. They would have to hold that some physical states are uncaused. The only other option is a loop of physical causes.

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