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NYrepublican

Blatant violation of the 8th amendment

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Paul Manafort is being kept in solitary 23/7 (that's the max allowed by the Supreme Court) I think this falls under the "cruel and excessive punishments" clause of the 8th amendment.

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11 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

Paul Manafort is being kept in solitary 23/7 (that's the max allowed by the Supreme Court) I think this falls under the "cruel and excessive punishments" clause of the 8th amendment.

I heard that they were doing it for his own protection, believe it or not. 

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1 minute ago, vcczar said:

I heard that they were doing it for his own protection, believe it or not. 

OK

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10 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

Paul Manafort is being kept in solitary 23/7 (that's the max allowed by the Supreme Court) I think this falls under the "cruel and excessive punishments" clause of the 8th amendment.

Is he being tortured, denied reasonable appropriate food and water allocations, kept in a dark, concrete, lightless dungeon, forced to labour for government profit, or other conditions of many prisoners in Third World nations that are much more likely what the 8th Amendment REALLY refers to?

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Just now, Patine said:

Is he being tortured, denied reasonable appropriate food and water allocations, kept in a dark, concrete, lightless dungeon, forced to labour for government profit, or other conditions of many prisoners in Third World nations that are much more likely what the 8th Amendment REALLY refers to?

Solitary is generally considered only appropriate for a select few circumstances in the US

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16 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

Paul Manafort is being kept in solitary 23/7 (that's the max allowed by the Supreme Court) I think this falls under the "cruel and excessive punishments" clause of the 8th amendment.

In fact, a lot of the conditions in those vile, despicable, inhuman, sociopathic, and corrupt "privatized prisons" in many U.S. (and the whole concept that State governments allow, and even formally arranged, their existence, as well as the "conviction quota" system that's part of the deal - a gross, horrid, and blatant violation of the very concept of justice itself), I firmly believe are, themselves, a violation of the 8th Amendment.

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2 hours ago, NYrepublican said:

Paul Manafort is being kept in solitary 23/7 (that's the max allowed by the Supreme Court) I think this falls under the "cruel and excessive punishments" clause of the 8th amendment.

It's cruel and unusual punishments, along with excessive bail and fines, that the 8th amendment prohibits.  Excessive punishments are not prohibited by this amendment.

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Just now, pilight said:

It's cruel and unusual punishments, along with excessive bail and fines, that the 8th amendment prohibits.  Excessive punishments are not prohibited by this amendment.

I think excessive punishments should be considered cruel.

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@NYrepublican I can't help but notice the sole focus of your outrage on 8th Amendment violation is a publicly-known, wealthy, white, former Trump Administration staffer. Why no mention at all of the violations of the 8th Amendment in this way, and a number of other notable ways, that happen routinely in the U.S. to usually poor prisoners of typically Black, Hispanic, and, since the Bush era, Middle-Eastern descended citizens by the U.S. and many State judicial and correctional systems?

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Just now, Patine said:

@NYrepublican I can't help but notice the sole focus of your outrage on 8th Amendment violation is a publicly-known, wealthy, white, former Trump Administration staffer. Why no mention at all of the violations of the 8th Amendment in this way, and a number of other notable ways, that happen routinely in the U.S. to usually poor prisoners of typically Black, Hispanic, and, since the Bush era, Middle-Eastern descended citizens by the U.S. and many State judicial and correctional systems?

I think I've agreed with you a number of times on how for-profit prisons and such are immoral.

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3 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

I think I've agreed with you a number of times on how for-profit prisons and such are immoral.

Oh, have you? It's been a long time since they were last discussed here.

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1 minute ago, Patine said:

Oh, have you? It's been a long time since they were last discussed here.

Yes I have.

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6 hours ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

How are for-profit prisons immoral?

The idea there is a monetary incentive to keep one behind bars is immoral, as the warden has a financial incentive to keep everyone behind bars- regardless if they were of good moral standing behind bars. Also for-profit prisons are in the business to make profit, not to reform convicts; so they will invest resources to insure former prisoners transition into society easily- and will cut costs in other areas such as: healthcare, and food. 

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7 hours ago, Sunnymentoaddict said:

The idea there is a monetary incentive to keep one behind bars is immoral, as the warden has a financial incentive to keep everyone behind bars- regardless if they were of good moral standing behind bars. Also for-profit prisons are in the business to make profit, not to reform convicts; so they will invest resources to insure former prisoners transition into society easily- and will cut costs in other areas such as: healthcare, and food. 

This can easily be solved by offering reform grants, and safety, and sanitary inspections.

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11 minutes ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

This can easily be solved by offering reform grants, and safety, and sanitary inspections.

No, it can be solved when a government realizes there are certain things that should NEVER be privatized. What's next - the military, the police, those alphabet soup agencies, the Federal Electoral Commission? What, abolish the IRS and put tax-farming like many nations in the late Medieval age to the 18th Century in some parts of the world used in place? I mean, really? Where does it end?

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9 minutes ago, Patine said:

What's next - the military, the police, those alphabet soup agencies, the Federal Electoral Commission?

 

Got some news for you bro...

But fr there's all kinds of privatized militaries and security businesses all over the world that operate efficiently.

And yes abolishing the IRS would be great too. (And the Federal Reserve)

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2 minutes ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

Got some news for you bro...

But fr there's all kinds of privatized militaries and security businesses all over the world that operate efficiently.

And yes abolishing the IRS would be great too. (And the Federal Reserve)

Privatized militaries and securities have another name they tend not to use as self-referencial anymore, because the words is stained from historical usage - that word being "mercenary."

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1 minute ago, Patine said:

Privatized militaries and securities have another name they tend not to use as self-referencial anymore, because the words is stained from historical usage - that word being "mercenary."

So? Mercenary is basically an archaic word at this point, and history has shown that the longer a word is around, the more negative annotations are added to it, see "queer", and, "retard".

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6 minutes ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

So? Mercenary is basically an archaic word at this point, and history has shown that the longer a word is around, the more negative annotations are added to it, see "queer", and, "retard".

It's using analogous words to present the same idea in a different light, and try to make it seem different. George W. Bush said the Geneva Conventions only applied to "Prisoners of Wars" and not "Captured Enemy Combatants." Didn't he realize how stupid, and insulting to the intelligence, he sounded using two analogous as though were, somehow magically, completely different and justified completely different interpretations of a set of treaties the U.S. had signed in good faith and had long quoted against the Axis Fascist Powers, the East Bloc and tin-pot despots for decades themselves. There's another good example.

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1 minute ago, Patine said:

It's using analogous words to present the same idea in a different light, and try to make it seem different. George W. Bush said the Geneva Conventions only applied to "Prisoners of Wars" and not "Captured Enemy Combatants." Didn't he realize how stupid, and insulting to the intelligence, he sounded using two analogous as though were, somehow magically, completely different and justified completely different interpretations of a set of treaties the U.S. had signed in good faith and had long quoted against the Axis Fascist Powers, the, East Bloc and tin-pot despots for decades themselves. There's another good example.

Those are all definitely great examples. Thank you for the perspective. (Although I still believe that for-profit prisons are beneficial. Wouldn't ever consider swapping our military with a paramilitary or mercenary group though)

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3 minutes ago, Patine said:

It's using analogous words to present the same idea in a different light, and try to make it seem different. George W. Bush said the Geneva Conventions only applied to "Prisoners of Wars" and not "Captured Enemy Combatants." Didn't he realize how stupid, and insulting to the intelligence, he sounded using two analogous as though were, somehow magically, completely different and justified completely different interpretations of a set of treaties the U.S. had signed in good faith and had long quoted against the Axis Fascist Powers, the, East Bloc and tin-pot despots for decades themselves. There's another good example.

Here's his explanation

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Praesent lectus sapien, imperdiet et porta vitae, venenatis ut felis. Aenean metus ligula, placerat in malesuada eget, faucibus in risus. Cras justo dui, convallis at luctus sit amet, ornare eget lacus. Praesent imperdiet venenatis magna, eu porta augue pellentesque aliquet. In molestie mauris a urna egestas pellentesque. Proin felis augue, tempus quis arcu sit amet, scelerisque egestas velit. Aenean tincidunt ligula ac nunc fringilla pulvinar. Sed dignissim nulla a ex pulvinar, id fringilla quam ullamcorper. Proin vestibulum erat ligula, eget interdum tellus faucibus ac. Curabitur lacus lacus, egestas at suscipit sit amet, dictum ac ante. Suspendisse sit amet lectus euismod, placerat dui id, volutpat erat. Praesent pretium metus vel tortor maximus feugiat. Nulla ac erat volutpat, mattis odio ac, iaculis sapien. Nam porta scelerisque leo sit amet venenatis. Aenean commodo elementum scelerisque.

Donec purus felis, consequat vitae ex sit amet, sagittis auctor sem. Fusce tempor massa ex, vitae efficitur nunc placerat sit amet. Proin at ornare orci, a fermentum tortor. Integer sed ante sed orci interdum laoreet. Phasellus id egestas quam. Vestibulum mattis egestas tempus. Nulla fermentum ultrices feugiat. Integer ligula arcu, tempor quis ipsum quis, sagittis sollicitudin nisl. Vivamus ultricies nec mauris eu malesuada. Fusce faucibus lacinia massa, at efficitur ex semper ut. Phasellus felis turpis, pretium bibendum pretium non, suscipit at massa. Morbi ac rutrum risus.

Nulla in ex eget sapien congue bibendum id ut tellus. Pellentesque congue ante non blandit suscipit. Mauris eu mauris vulputate, tempus massa eu, tempus dolor. Ut maximus nisl id dignissim varius. Sed libero ex, porttitor eget accumsan in, dictum id nisl. Aliquam ut quam lectus. Donec vitae iaculis nisi, faucibus finibus lacus. Aliquam placerat non massa ac aliquam. Pellentesque et ex viverra, ultricies augue eu, consequat lacus. Nulla felis dui, tempus sed justo sed, iaculis imperdiet elit. Donec ac luctus erat, nec malesuada nulla. Pellentesque accumsan ex sollicitudin metus iaculis, eget bibendum tortor ultricies. Nulla fringilla erat nec eros posuere, sed feugiat nisl vehicula. Sed at pretium magna. Suspendisse molestie est erat, ac ornare felis malesuada id.

Aliquam sit amet felis ac lacus iaculis interdum eget et libero. Integer consequat, dolor eget iaculis pharetra, nisi odio laoreet turpis, vitae vulputate quam dolor vel enim. Mauris erat sem, tempus ac fringilla sit amet, tincidunt in ipsum. Sed volutpat consequat nibh et tempor. Mauris at justo ipsum. Nam fringilla, lacus vel tempus molestie, velit elit placerat enim, in ultricies purus mauris non mauris. Sed molestie eros dolor, dignissim finibus nulla blandit id. Donec dapibus mi magna, non elementum turpis sagittis vitae. Aliquam lacinia orci et sagittis tincidunt. Integer magna dolor, accumsan sollicitudin maximus eget, tempus quis metus.

Duis mattis consectetur pharetra. Morbi non augue sapien. Sed ac ipsum hendrerit est tincidunt tempus sed quis mi. Cras quis leo lacus. Suspendisse nec dapibus felis. Vestibulum ac ligula ut enim pellentesque efficitur. Nullam non vulputate metus. Praesent ultricies, tellus auctor iaculis molestie, lectus sapien maximus purus, in tempor massa tortor et ligula. Sed suscipit sapien in risus ullamcorper ultrices. Morbi posuere interdum nisl a hendrerit. Pellentesque iaculis urna et elementum dictum. Cras interdum suscipit mi, quis mollis sem rhoncus et.

Vivamus consectetur eleifend justo vel feugiat. Fusce iaculis nibh et enim ornare, a elementum elit porta. Mauris in arcu suscipit, laoreet massa quis, vehicula nibh. In ornare velit a posuere sagittis. Pellentesque elementum urna quis arcu vulputate, ut luctus dui condimentum. Integer et urna metus. Nullam non augue a odio hendrerit ullamcorper sit amet in tortor. Mauris pellentesque dolor ante, eget elementum enim sagittis quis. Sed magna lacus, consectetur maximus libero ac, pellentesque eleifend turpis. Vivamus blandit, leo et ultrices feugiat, metus elit auctor urna, vel semper nisi nulla sit amet dolor. Nunc sagittis pulvinar elit, sit amet vulputate neque. Sed volutpat feugiat arcu. Nam sagittis nisl ac mollis tincidunt. Fusce consequat sapien quis orci bibendum, in consectetur orci blandit. Aliquam porta scelerisque tellus ac aliquet.

Suspendisse potenti. Nulla facilisi. Pellentesque venenatis viverra arcu, posuere placerat elit pharetra nec. Morbi nec varius nibh. In sit amet nulla imperdiet, rhoncus erat quis, porta purus. Ut diam lacus, laoreet placerat sollicitudin ut, porta nec lorem. Donec suscipit maximus consectetur. Nullam eget nisl quis nibh facilisis imperdiet vel sit amet sem. Nulla tristique lorem quis cursus semper.

Nullam dictum volutpat interdum. Donec mauris odio, auctor quis rhoncus sed, dictum vel odio. Praesent efficitur eu lorem vitae interdum. Fusce posuere, mi eget blandit vestibulum, ligula lorem bibendum 

/s

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1 minute ago, NYrepublican said:

Here's his explanation

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Praesent lectus sapien, imperdiet et porta vitae, venenatis ut felis. Aenean metus ligula, placerat in malesuada eget, faucibus in risus. Cras justo dui, convallis at luctus sit amet, ornare eget lacus. Praesent imperdiet venenatis magna, eu porta augue pellentesque aliquet. In molestie mauris a urna egestas pellentesque. Proin felis augue, tempus quis arcu sit amet, scelerisque egestas velit. Aenean tincidunt ligula ac nunc fringilla pulvinar. Sed dignissim nulla a ex pulvinar, id fringilla quam ullamcorper. Proin vestibulum erat ligula, eget interdum tellus faucibus ac. Curabitur lacus lacus, egestas at suscipit sit amet, dictum ac ante. Suspendisse sit amet lectus euismod, placerat dui id, volutpat erat. Praesent pretium metus vel tortor maximus feugiat. Nulla ac erat volutpat, mattis odio ac, iaculis sapien. Nam porta scelerisque leo sit amet venenatis. Aenean commodo elementum scelerisque.

Donec purus felis, consequat vitae ex sit amet, sagittis auctor sem. Fusce tempor massa ex, vitae efficitur nunc placerat sit amet. Proin at ornare orci, a fermentum tortor. Integer sed ante sed orci interdum laoreet. Phasellus id egestas quam. Vestibulum mattis egestas tempus. Nulla fermentum ultrices feugiat. Integer ligula arcu, tempor quis ipsum quis, sagittis sollicitudin nisl. Vivamus ultricies nec mauris eu malesuada. Fusce faucibus lacinia massa, at efficitur ex semper ut. Phasellus felis turpis, pretium bibendum pretium non, suscipit at massa. Morbi ac rutrum risus.

Nulla in ex eget sapien congue bibendum id ut tellus. Pellentesque congue ante non blandit suscipit. Mauris eu mauris vulputate, tempus massa eu, tempus dolor. Ut maximus nisl id dignissim varius. Sed libero ex, porttitor eget accumsan in, dictum id nisl. Aliquam ut quam lectus. Donec vitae iaculis nisi, faucibus finibus lacus. Aliquam placerat non massa ac aliquam. Pellentesque et ex viverra, ultricies augue eu, consequat lacus. Nulla felis dui, tempus sed justo sed, iaculis imperdiet elit. Donec ac luctus erat, nec malesuada nulla. Pellentesque accumsan ex sollicitudin metus iaculis, eget bibendum tortor ultricies. Nulla fringilla erat nec eros posuere, sed feugiat nisl vehicula. Sed at pretium magna. Suspendisse molestie est erat, ac ornare felis malesuada id.

Aliquam sit amet felis ac lacus iaculis interdum eget et libero. Integer consequat, dolor eget iaculis pharetra, nisi odio laoreet turpis, vitae vulputate quam dolor vel enim. Mauris erat sem, tempus ac fringilla sit amet, tincidunt in ipsum. Sed volutpat consequat nibh et tempor. Mauris at justo ipsum. Nam fringilla, lacus vel tempus molestie, velit elit placerat enim, in ultricies purus mauris non mauris. Sed molestie eros dolor, dignissim finibus nulla blandit id. Donec dapibus mi magna, non elementum turpis sagittis vitae. Aliquam lacinia orci et sagittis tincidunt. Integer magna dolor, accumsan sollicitudin maximus eget, tempus quis metus.

Duis mattis consectetur pharetra. Morbi non augue sapien. Sed ac ipsum hendrerit est tincidunt tempus sed quis mi. Cras quis leo lacus. Suspendisse nec dapibus felis. Vestibulum ac ligula ut enim pellentesque efficitur. Nullam non vulputate metus. Praesent ultricies, tellus auctor iaculis molestie, lectus sapien maximus purus, in tempor massa tortor et ligula. Sed suscipit sapien in risus ullamcorper ultrices. Morbi posuere interdum nisl a hendrerit. Pellentesque iaculis urna et elementum dictum. Cras interdum suscipit mi, quis mollis sem rhoncus et.

Vivamus consectetur eleifend justo vel feugiat. Fusce iaculis nibh et enim ornare, a elementum elit porta. Mauris in arcu suscipit, laoreet massa quis, vehicula nibh. In ornare velit a posuere sagittis. Pellentesque elementum urna quis arcu vulputate, ut luctus dui condimentum. Integer et urna metus. Nullam non augue a odio hendrerit ullamcorper sit amet in tortor. Mauris pellentesque dolor ante, eget elementum enim sagittis quis. Sed magna lacus, consectetur maximus libero ac, pellentesque eleifend turpis. Vivamus blandit, leo et ultrices feugiat, metus elit auctor urna, vel semper nisi nulla sit amet dolor. Nunc sagittis pulvinar elit, sit amet vulputate neque. Sed volutpat feugiat arcu. Nam sagittis nisl ac mollis tincidunt. Fusce consequat sapien quis orci bibendum, in consectetur orci blandit. Aliquam porta scelerisque tellus ac aliquet.

Suspendisse potenti. Nulla facilisi. Pellentesque venenatis viverra arcu, posuere placerat elit pharetra nec. Morbi nec varius nibh. In sit amet nulla imperdiet, rhoncus erat quis, porta purus. Ut diam lacus, laoreet placerat sollicitudin ut, porta nec lorem. Donec suscipit maximus consectetur. Nullam eget nisl quis nibh facilisis imperdiet vel sit amet sem. Nulla tristique lorem quis cursus semper.

Nullam dictum volutpat interdum. Donec mauris odio, auctor quis rhoncus sed, dictum vel odio. Praesent efficitur eu lorem vitae interdum. Fusce posuere, mi eget blandit vestibulum, ligula lorem bibendum 

/s

I didn't know Bush was fluent in Latin...

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22 minutes ago, Patine said:

I didn't know Bush was fluent in Latin...

It's not really Latin, it's Lorem Ipsum (which is based on Latin)

People use it to choose fonts and stuff for web design, since the gibberish won't bias their selection like different font names would.

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20 hours ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

This can easily be solved by offering reform grants, and safety, and sanitary inspections.

I work as a manager of regional grocery store, and I can honestly tell you from a management perspective that if there is an economic incentive to ignore regulations- or do the bare minimum to avoid any fines from the government. 

Offering grants, in my opinion won't do anything, except just giving more money to corporations that are already making a profit. 

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