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יִשְׂרָאֵל‬  

23 members have voted

  1. 1. Does Israel Have a Right to Exist?

    • Yes, Israel has a right to exist.
    • No, Israel has no right to exist.
    • No Opinion/Undecided/Prefer not to answer
      0
    • Other (Explain below)
  2. 2. Should we fund Israel?

    • Yes, Israel is an ally and beacon of Democracy in the Middle East.
    • No, Israel is extorting us for money, and is an unreliable ally.
    • No Opinion/Undecided/Prefer not to answer
    • Other (Explain below)
  3. 3. How should the Israeli-Palestinian conflict be solved?

    • The land belongs to Israel (including Palestine)
    • The land belongs to Palestine (Including Israel)
    • The current two-state solution works fine
    • No Opinion/Undecided/Prefer not to answer
    • Other (Explain below)


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2 hours ago, vcczar said:

@ThePotatoWalrus @Patine @NYrepublican

Both people have a right to their own separate, independent nations. The nation's should be split according to where the populations are. Places with more Palestinians than Israeli's should be part of Palestine, and places with more Israelis than Palestinians should be be part of Israel. However, a majority Israeli or majority Palestinian town could opt to be part of the other country. Population would be based off the latest census, to prevent a Bleeding Kansas episode. I think letting the people decide would be better than letting the leaders decide in this regard. We should fund Israel and Palestine equally. We should promise defense only to the side that is attacked by the other. Any political party advocating extermination or removal of Israelis or Palestinians will be condemned by the US and UN and funding, aid, and support will be cut off to these countries if they are led by these parties. Those desiring of, tolerant of, genocide are no better than Nazis. Anyone not condemning Israeli or Palestinian parties that view genocide as an acceptable policy are no better than Nazis. 

 

The issue is that the PA does a bad job at conducting censuses.

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28 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

The issue is that the PA does a bad job at conducting censuses.

Have the UN do a census for this Peace Plan with a complete transparency and judicial oversight. 

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as someone who currently lives in Israel, (moving to Canada soon tho) i don't think that it's fair to show examples of fringe extremist politicians to show Israel as a genociding state, just look at the Gaza Strip, an area controlled by a flippin' terrorist group (Hamas)

 

P.S also Israeli politics is controlled by two major parties, the Right Wing Likud and the Leftist Labour Party (Havoda), while third parties are more powerful than let's say the US but the main fight is usually between those two.

feel free to ask me questions 

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Just now, Ido said:

as someone who currently lives in Israel, (moving to Canada soon tho) i don't think that it's fair to show examples of fringe extremist politicians to show Israel as a genociding state, just look at the Gaza Strip, an area controlled by a flippin' terrorist group (Hamas)

I, myself, pointed out that there's extremists on both sides, and they're ALL sabotaging progress in a solution in the area, as are certain extreme "foreign supporters" of both sides. I am, moreso than many, one whose willing to see fault in both (or all sides) concerned in a given issue, give a more balanced perspective, and take both (or all sides) to task. It's a sorry and pitiful sign of the world we live in that this stance makes me more enemies, gets me more flack, and earns me less "cred" than just sheepishly, obediently "taking a socio-political side" down the line does... :(

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well i hope the sides will compromise for once, if it will keep the peace then i'm all for it.

i am as neutral as it can be as someone who lives there,

 

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12 minutes ago, Ido said:

yeah i know that there are extremists on both sides, just that Israeli is less susceptible to extremism than Palestine, also i don't say that anyone is perfect, both sides have their bad ones, just that Israel is the better choice because as of currently Hamas controls Gaza and endlessly shoots rockets to Israel instead of developing Gaza which they obviously could do

also Israeli extremists are much less numerous than Palestinian terrorists (i acknowdlege that they do exist tho)

 

i do want for both sides to compromise for once tho

Susceptilibility to extremism changes over time and by zeitgeist. Back when I was younger in the '80's and early '90's, I would have said my American neighbours to the South were not realistically susceptible in the mainstream to extremism - that it was only marginal. Now look at today. Conversely, in modern Germany, extremists are marginal, and even often shunned - a BIG change from the '20's to 40's.

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51 minutes ago, Ido said:

i don't think that it's fair to show examples of fringe extremist politicians to show Israel as a genociding state

I didn't know the Minister of Justice could be called a fringe extremist. 

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well i meant that genociding palestinians isn't a mainstream thought

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also for Patine, well i hope that Israel will stay susceptible to extremism, the last thing the region needs is an extremist Israel

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5 hours ago, Ido said:

well i meant that genociding palestinians isn't a mainstream thought

Also parties have been banned for it see כך for example.

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14 minutes ago, NYrepublican said:

Also parties have been banned for it see כך for example.

I'm not clear on the "example" refered to by a single Hebrew letter. Did you mean to link something?

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11 minutes ago, Patine said:

I'm not clear on the "example" refered to by a single Hebrew letter. Did you mean to link something?

The Kach party 

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For now the US should continue to fund Israel, but I would like to see the aid slowly withdrawn (as with the rest of foreign aid that the US gives)

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3 minutes ago, jvikings1 said:

For now the US should continue to fund Israel, but I would like to see the aid slowly withdrawn (as with the rest of foreign aid that the US gives)

For a lot of people claiming Christian or Jewish convictions, or strong secular Liberal viewpoints, on these forums (and in the Western World as a whole), Manichaeism seems to have a strong, inordinate, worrisome grip on these self-same people, regardless of their self-labeled world view. It often comes out a lot clearer on issues like these.

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16 minutes ago, Patine said:

For a lot of people claiming Christian or Jewish convictions, or strong secular Liberal viewpoints, on these forums (and in the Western World as a whole), Manichaeism seems to have a strong, inordinate, worrisome grip on these self-same people, regardless of their self-labeled world view. It often comes out a lot clearer on issues like these.

I don't appreciate being accused of being apart of religious dualism.  I am totally a Christian.  Christ is the only way to be saved.  There is no alternative.

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1 minute ago, jvikings1 said:

I don't appreciate being accused of being apart of religious dualism.  I am totally a Christian.  Christ is the only way to be saved.  There is no alternative.

You do seem a bit judgemental and unforgiving and supportive of "social shunning of sinners" to live up to Christ's obvious ministry. But THAT seems more and more common of Christian communities in the modern day. Although, I'll admit, you haven't openly supported theocracy, but have given support at times to politicians who have (like Cruz). I worry about a world where Christ's actual ministry is a "minority opinion" in Christianity as a whole.

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