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ThePotatoWalrus

Al Franken Resigns

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1 hour ago, WVProgressive said:

Hmm. Progressive but also centrist enough to pleas more establishment style democrats. I think it could work.

By the way is that Paula Jean Swearengin as your profile picture. I learned about her from the Jimmy Dore Show :P

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3 hours ago, ThePotatoWalrus said:

That comment was completely unnecessary and lacked class. (If I'm going down I'm taking you with me) I used to respect him, but now all of that is gone. (I also agree that Roy Moore should drop out, he is a fat, racist, ignorant, pathetic excuse for a Christian man)

I'll agree with you that Franken was trying to take Trump and Moore down with him in his resignation speech, but I wouldn't call it unnecessary, since these are also men that should resign for similar reasons. I think you would also agree that Trump, nearly daily, says equivalent "unnecessary" things about Democrats and Republicans, which similarly "lacks class" as well. I'm sure, being an independent thinker, you condemn Trump just as strongly as you do Franken, and possibly Moore.  

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Found this within a poem by James Brooks Wheelwright (who died about 1940), it's as if he were writing about Trump-era America:

Hate rules our drowning Race. 
Any freed from our Tyrant; / abandon their farms, forsake their Country, become American.

We, the least subtle of Peoples, / lead each only one life at a time, - 
Being never, never anything but sincere; / yet we trust our honesty 
So little that we dare not depart from it, - / knowing it to need habitual stimulation. 
And living amid a world of Spooks, / we summon another to us 
Who is (in some sort) our Clown, - / as he affords us amusement.

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4 hours ago, LokiLoki22 said:

That's assuming he holds his office in the 2018 midterms. I hear Kasich will be challenging him, which makes for an interesting senate battle.

Not saying you are wrong, but Mandel is the strongest candidate right now in the GoP primary, and he worked with Kasich the last 4 years. I'm not sure Kasich would even run, as I couldn't find a poll with him as a choice. Then again, this time two years ago I said this sentence, "Oh you don't need to worry about him, there's 16 other candidates that can defeat before the convention!"

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18 minutes ago, SeanFKennedy said:

By the way is that Paula Jean Swearengin as your profile picture. I learned about her from the Jimmy Dore Show :P

Absolutely! She's what we here need to rebuild WV after the death of coal and she unlike Corporate Joe Manchin hasn't taken a dime from Big Coal or any other corporation!

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21 minutes ago, vcczar said:

Found this within a poem by James Brooks Wheelwright (who died about 1940), it's as if he were writing about Trump-era America:

What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

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4 minutes ago, pilight said:

What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

I beg to differ with the sentiment of that poem...

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1 hour ago, vcczar said:

I'll agree with you that Franken was trying to take Trump and Moore down with him in his resignation speech, but I wouldn't call it unnecessary, since these are also men that should resign for similar reasons. I think you would also agree that Trump, nearly daily, says equivalent "unnecessary" things about Democrats and Republicans, which similarly "lacks class" as well. I'm sure, being an independent thinker, you condemn Trump just as strongly as you do Franken, and possibly Moore.  

Roy Moore is exactly why I left the corrupt and pathetic Republican Party. I agree that Trump has many uncouth comments, but some I believe are necessary and even entertaining (most are ridiculous, but Rocket Man was hilarious). Personally, I like him(and Franken), but from an unbiased view, they are both contributing to making our country a laughing stock, it's just that what Franken did trying to hit on Trump (when he has no room to do so) completely lacked class.

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1 hour ago, Patine said:

I beg to differ with the sentiment of that poem...

It's not a poem; it's from the Book of Ecclesiastes. Technology was a lot less advanced at the time and depending on where one draws the line between this or that it could be dead on or was only at the time. A senet board is a device for amusement and so too is a PS4 so it didn't make a new category that broad although as an individual thing it certainly was new. 

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2 hours ago, vcczar said:

Found this within a poem by James Brooks Wheelwright (who died about 1940), it's as if he were writing about Trump-era America:

Hate rules our drowning Race. 
Any freed from our Tyrant; / abandon their farms, forsake their Country, become American.

We, the least subtle of Peoples, / lead each only one life at a time, - 
Being never, never anything but sincere; / yet we trust our honesty 
So little that we dare not depart from it, - / knowing it to need habitual stimulation. 
And living amid a world of Spooks, / we summon another to us 
Who is (in some sort) our Clown, - / as he affords us amusement.

Wonder what @Patine's thoughts are on this poem

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5 minutes ago, vcczar said:

Wonder what @Patine's thoughts are on this poem

You must forgive me, but prose is by far a much preferred medium of writing and appreciating literature for me than poetry. I'm trying to figure out his exact message here. His context for the word "Spooks," notably, is unfamiliar, but I assume he doesn't mean either the hacking/intelligence community slang, or creepy people running around the neighbourhood scaring people off (then again, he might well mean the latter).

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12 hours ago, vcczar said:

I'd say it's a 99% chance he doesn't run. I think if the scandals had never come out (or if he had never done any of those things), then he would have been the best candidate to defeat Trump in 2020. That said, Al Franken is right to resign for doing what he did, and with the scandals having happened, he is no longer a threat to Trump if does run in 2020. I can't think of a single Democratic potential candidate that has what pre-scandal Al Franken had as a candidate (intellect w/ top-rate sense humor, near-battle ground state, reformist ideology, national recognition, not-too-old). Hopefully, his resignation puts pressure on getting Roy Moore to drop out. 

Agree

11 hours ago, LokiLoki22 said:

I agree with VC that Al Franklin was in thewrong, and I believe that his resignation took too long. there should be no space for sexual harassment in the Capitol these days, even if that means losing candidates that I agree with. In that regard, I hope it puts Trump in context (walking in on underage contestants dressing, kissing married women against their will, the infamous grab her by the pussy comment). In my opinion, there is no place for that in our government, representing our people, no matter who it's from (side-eyes Bill Clinton). While I think that it was unfair to judge Hillary based on her husband's crimes, I'm waiting on an apology from Bill.

Agree, especially with the part I bolded

11 hours ago, vcczar said:

I agree with Franken's resignation comment, "I am leaving while a man who has bragged on tape about his history of sexual assault sits in the oval office." 

Trump should resign, and Moore should drop out. 

Yep.

 

I used to be a Franken 2020 guy, now I hope Kamala Harris and Tammy Baldwin beat Trump and Pence in 2020. Not only would a Harris/Baldwin administration be competent and respectable, but there would be something extremely satisfying about Trump being replaced by a (relatively) young, progressive, African/Indian-American woman from California, and Mike "I call my wife 'mother' and don't like gay people" Pence being replaced by the first open lesbian to be elected to the US Senate.

Sherrod Brown is extremely bland and unexciting to me, and he might lose in 2018, though it looks like the midterms will be a wave of at least 2014 proportions, possibly even reaching 2010 heights, (except for the Democrats rather than Republicans), in which case I'd expect he'd win. I'd still vote for him in the 2020 general if he was the nominee; the Democrats could nominate the long-decayed corpse of the goldfish I had when I was 5 (his name was Zachary) and I'd vote for him over Donald Trump. I'd just hope the Dems nominate someone actually exciting for which I can cast my first Presidential ballot.

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6 hours ago, Bruce Fischer said:

Agree

Agree, especially with the part I bolded

Yep.

 

I used to be a Franken 2020 guy, now I hope Kamala Harris and Tammy Baldwin beat Trump and Pence in 2020. Not only would a Harris/Baldwin administration be competent and respectable, but there would be something extremely satisfying about Trump being replaced by a (relatively) young, progressive, African/Indian-American woman from California, and Mike "I call my wife 'mother' and don't like gay people" Pence being replaced by the first open lesbian to be elected to the US Senate.

Sherrod Brown is extremely bland and unexciting to me, and he might lose in 2018, though it looks like the midterms will be a wave of at least 2014 proportions, possibly even reaching 2010 heights, (except for the Democrats rather than Republicans), in which case I'd expect he'd win. I'd still vote for him in the 2020 general if he was the nominee; the Democrats could nominate the long-decayed corpse of the goldfish I had when I was 5 (his name was Zachary) and I'd vote for him over Donald Trump. I'd just hope the Dems nominate someone actually exciting for which I can cast my first Presidential ballot.

Hell, I'd vote for a decayed goldfish, can't actually hurt anyone.

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21 hours ago, Patine said:

Trump seems to see nothing wrong with anything he does and believes he's bulletproof. His ego and sense of inability to be considered "wrong" is reminiscent of absolute monarchs of Antiquity and the Middle Ages (though fortunately he can't casually order horrible and imaginative summary executions for people just for displeasing him - not like Kim Jong Un, can...).

You'd think he would by now, being the tyrant he is!

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Quote

Trump seems to see nothing wrong with anything he does and believes he's bulletproof. His ego and sense of inability to be considered "wrong" is reminiscent of absolute monarchs of Antiquity and the Middle Ages (though fortunately he can't casually order horrible and imaginative summary executions for people just for displeasing him - not like Kim Jong Un, can...).

Such is politics; right is what we do and wrong is what our enemies do. For a country that's mostly made up of de jure Christians there sure is a lot of moral relativism in American politics. I see no more reason to not be a moral absolutist than to not believe that the world really exists and it's not an illusion produced by mad scientists stimulating brains in a vat and worse yet to say that morality depends on the identity of the person/group rather than values like justice or whatever is egotistical. Though I guess one has to be egotistical to want to get elected.

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4 hours ago, European Qoheleth (SANC) said:

Such is politics; right is what we do and wrong is what our enemies do. For a country that's mostly made up of de jure Christians there sure is a lot of moral relativism in American politics. I see no more reason to not be a moral absolutist than to not believe that the world really exists and it's not an illusion produced by mad scientists stimulating brains in a vat and worse yet to say that morality depends on the identity of the person/group rather than values like justice or whatever is egotistical. Though I guess one has to be egotistical to want to get elected.

The real problem ends up being when the "right is what we do and wrong is what our enemies do" promoted by government and ideologues are pretty much, in essence, the same thing as each other.

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10 minutes ago, Wiw said:

The US government means to destroy us all!

Don't be silly...they'd lose to many obedient workers.

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23 hours ago, Presidentinsertname said:

the democrat best chance to beat trump would be a blue dog democrat with a progressive running mate.

Actually if you look at the polls the opposite is true Americans want Single-Payer Health Care, they want drug legalization, they don't want to be in the middle east, when you look at the polls Americans are Left-Wing.

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21 hours ago, WVProgressive said:

Don't be silly...they'd lose to many obedient workers.

Why not? That's clearly what is happening.

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19 minutes ago, Wiw said:

Why not? That's clearly what is happening.

They'd never do that and the reason is that would be hostile to the owners. The owners want a populace smart enough to run the machines and push buttons all day, a population of obedient workers. They'd never get rid of that because they know without it they would be powerless.     

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On 12/8/2017 at 9:28 AM, Presidentinsertname said:

the democrat best chance to beat trump would be a blue dog democrat with a progressive running mate.

That's what I had thought for a very long time, but I'm starting to doubt that. The Democrats need someone who will bring excitement to the race and make people want to vote for them. Progressives like Sanders, Franken, and hopefully more to come soon have done just that. A progressive nominee might be the Democrats only chance of getting a loyal base who's out to get their nominee elected. No one wanted Clinton, and it showed. 

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50 minutes ago, WVProgressive said:

They'd never do that and the reason is that would be hostile to the owners. The owners want a populace smart enough to run the machines and push buttons all day, a population of obedient workers. They'd never get rid of that because they know without it they would be powerless.     

That may be difficult, considering they're crippling the economy to their favour.

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