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26 minutes ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

1.Venezuela is Socialist not Communist there's a difference.

2.Cuba was ruled by a U.S backed dictatorship and the U.S had meddled in its politics for years (example:The Platt Amendment)

3. China and the USSR were led by morally corrupt officials so saying they demonstrated Communism is a stretch (For example Stalin's policies aimed at breaking the spirit of Ukrainians)

The kind of Socialism Venezuela is operated under is Soft Communism, no two ways around it. The Means of Production have been seized and are being distributed.

That has nothing to do with it, Cuba was actually quite prosperous under US rule, yes it had problems and I am not defending Bautista, but it wasn't as bad as under Castro.

All Communist states will end up with morally corrupt officials that find themselves in power, it is bound to happen.

 

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1 minute ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

I officially declare victory over the capitalist satanist @Reagan04

Patience is a virtue.

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3 minutes ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

I officially declare victory over the capitalist  @Reagan04

Besides you have yet to offer a substantive point that I haven't completely refuted, you are losing by a wide margin.

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1 minute ago, Reagan04 said:

The kind of Socialism Venezuela is operated under is Soft Communism, no two ways around it. The Means of Production have been seized and are being distributed.

That has nothing to do with it, Cuba was actually quite prosperous under US rule, yes it had problems and I am not defending Bautista, but it wasn't as bad as under Castro.

All Communist states will end up with morally corrupt officials that find themselves in power, it is bound to happen.

No the means of production aren't being distributed in Venezuela just seized.

Oh really,Batista led a military coup and we know just how well that ends up for the citizenry. (He only headed the country for 8 years so long term effects are unknowable in addition a true Communist leader doesn't waste 8 hours straight speaking to the nation daily)

Why do you believe that they'll always be morally corrupt officials in power under Communist rule?

 

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1 minute ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

No the means of production aren't being distributed in Venezuela just seized.

Oh really,Batista led a military coup and we know just how well that ends up for the citizenry. (He only headed the country for 8 years so long term effects are unknowable in addition a true Communist leader doesn't waste 8 hours straight speaking to the nation daily)

Why do you believe that they'll always be morally corrupt officials in power under Communist rule?

 

Oh no my friend, they have been distributed, but it never works like it does in the story books.

Again, the Social Aspect was pretty bad, Authoritarianism is quite terrible, but Castro was worse, and you can pull out and use the No True Scotsman Fallacy on me, no you are just grasping at straws because Communism is indefensible. He was a Communist and you just don't want to admit it.

Because Communism requires a strong government and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

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1 minute ago, Reagan04 said:

Oh no my friend, they have been distributed, but it never works like it does in the story books.

Again, the Social Aspect was pretty bad, Authoritarianism is quite terrible, but Castro was worse, and you can pull out and use the No True Scotsman Fallacy on me, no you are just grasping at straws because Communism is indefensible. He was a Communist and you just don't want to admit it.

Because Communism requires a strong government and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Authoritarianism has nothing to do with Communism they're fundamental opposites. All of the countries you cited as evidence were heeded by nonsensical mass murderers.

The means of production have been seized in Venezuela and given to Maduro and his Cronies.

Communism doesn't inherently require a strong central Govt. you just need people who realize the reality of their enslavement and will fight back.

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Just now, EndOfCapitalism said:

Authoritarianism has nothing to do with Communism they're fundamental opposites. All of the countries you cited as evidence were heeded by nonsensical mass murderers.

The means of production have been seized in Venezuela and given to Maduro and his Cronies.

Communism doesn't inherently require a strong central Govt. you just need people who realize the reality of their enslavement and will fight back.

They are not at all, you need a Government to make sure everyone is equal, only a Government with unlimited power has that ability.

See, that is the result of Socialism, and actually, that is just the final result, it resulted because in the Chavez era everyone thought it was great, that Soft Communism worked wonders, but eventually, companies left and there was no money left to redistribute, thus began the downward cycle we see today.

That is Anarchy, you are not a Communist, you are an Anarchist. The question I pose to you is, what happens after they fight back, what is the next step in your Communist Utopia?

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@EndOfCapitalism Ok I'm going to bed right now, continue this tomorrow, I am enjoying this debate.

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Communism requires authoritarian, big government because of human nature.  Communism is about equality of the masses which means that no one innovates in an attempt to get ahead because there would be no reward.

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@jvikings1 @Reagan04 @EndOfCapitalism 

I've returned, and seemingly in the nick of time. First of all, may I please discourage the original dominant part of this debate - comparing the quality or success of an economic by the perceived "body count" of the other. Such an argument is an inaccurate and distorted portrayal of what should be the priority of the argument and little more than a base and sensationalist tactic. Also, I myself, and this is from empirical knowledge and visible evidence of the world around me and how most people live in it (and economic forecasts and news I'm constantly reading), I strongly believe BOTH Capitalism and Communism have failed utterly as viable and fully functional economic systems and something new is really needed. What, you ask? I'm not quite sure, as I'm not an economist by profession like Adam Smith and Karl Marx were. We need (desperately) one or more economists with the actual drive and forward thinking and who actually give a damn to create a new economic system based on all we've learned (or should have learned) economically as a species to be the template for a new system going forward.

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@Patine Sorry about what happened a few days ago re-reading the posts made me realize I may have misinterpreted your posts.

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1 minute ago, NYrepublican said:

@Patine Sorry about what happened a few days ago re-reading the posts made me realize I may have misinterpreted your posts.

Like you often do. I think you're in too much of a hurry to type a "zinger" back at me.

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Just now, Patine said:

Like you often do. I think you're in too much of a hurry to type a "zinger" back at me.

What do you know i'm a born politician:lol:

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Also in the future,Patine,Please don't bring up racists in a discussion unrelated to them.

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3 hours ago, jvikings1 said:

Communism requires authoritarian, big government because of human nature.  Communism is about equality of the masses which means that no one innovates in an attempt to get ahead because there would be no reward.

Why do you dismiss all rewards that don't have to do with money such as Fame for example. @jvikings1

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4 hours ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

Also @Reagan04 according to a poll with the question "Is Communism good for society" 63% voted yes on a popular debating website.(http://www.debate.org/opinions/is-communism-good-for-society)

Ok, yeah suuure, a website poll really reliable.

1 hour ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

Since it's been 24 hours with no response from @Reagan04 I OFFICIALLY DECLARE VICTORY FOR COMMUNISM.

I think I've figured out that you are a troll, I don't sit behind a keyboard all day, unless you have good points I think Capitalism takes this one.

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Just now, EndOfCapitalism said:

I can't help but notice that this comment immidiately killed @jvikings1's argument.

Or just the fact that I have more important things to do such as my college work.  But, I can respond now that I don't have another class until an hour from now and I have an extended weekend for my homework which isn't very much.

22 hours ago, EndOfCapitalism said:

Why do you dismiss all rewards that don't have to do with money such as Fame for example. @jvikings1

In a communist state, the state takes credit for any advancements done.  Plus, they control the media which means that they control what people believe.  A person doesn't become famous unless the government wants them to be famous.  And, they can eliminate those who they think are undermining their message.

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On 8/31/2017 at 2:31 PM, jvikings1 said:

In a communist state, the state takes credit for any advancements done.  Plus, they control the media which means that they control what people believe.  A person doesn't become famous unless the government wants them to be famous.  And, they can eliminate those who they think are undermining their message.

I think you're confusing Communism and Socialism again.

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