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  2. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    'Aggressiveness' in relation to rhetoric might be the right sort of word. It could be a trait, with a rating on the opposite end being 'tactful', say. I'll think about it.
  3. vcczar

    Preferred 2020 Democratic Candidate

    He’s young, Hispanic, and has a little name recognition as 2012 keynote speaker. There really isn’t much appeal outside that. He needs more experience (we’ve had two inexperience presidents in a row), and he really isn’t a very aggressive person, which might be essential to taking on Trump. He’s likeable, rather than charismatic, much like Biden. Unlike Biden, he seems more canned, like Rubio, rather than conversational like Biden.
  4. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Ok, I guess I can accept that when one considers the “Cult of Personality” around Trump. I like your idea for inflammatory rhetoric. I think something like aggressiveness or composure might be a good name for such a trait. A word akin to “presidential” is what I’m thinking.
  5. Today
  6. Sunnymentoaddict

    Preferred 2020 Democratic Candidate

    Warren, Sanders, K Harris, H Clinton, Biden, J Castro(Honestly can someone explain to me the appeal to him? He seems like a rather generic Democrat), Booker, Avenatti, Trump.
  7. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Why do you think this would make things more onerous? The 0-10 scale seems more intuitive to me, and both require choosing one value, so no difference there.
  8. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    If that's the case, Trump's Integrity in the new system would be 2 or 3, Charisma would remain 7 or 8.
  9. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    An alternate mapping system is 1 -> 1 2 -> 3 3 -> 5 (both are true midpoints for respective systems) 4 -> 7 5 -> 9 In this case, I think the natural way to think of this would be 1 -> 0-1 2 -> 2-3 3 -> 4-6 (extra slot, mapping requires one has 3 slots) 4 -> 7-8 5 -> 9-10 I'm favoring this system now.
  10. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    To capture the rhetoric aspect would require a new game feature, something like an 'inflammatory rhetoric' meter for speeches and so on. The higher it is, the more people who aren't close on the issue position react negatively, perhaps.
  11. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    In The Art of the Deal, Trump talks about how people have always reacted strongly to him (both pro and con). In part, I think it's just the type of rhetoric he has chosen to use, in part the issue positions, but I also think Trump has a personality that is polarizing. In the 2016 campaign, old system, his Integrity is a 2. That maps onto a 3 or 4 using the mappings above.
  12. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    So I guess my next question is: What factor will you use to take into account what repels people about Trump, including members of his own party. It’s more than just policy. What level of integrity should he have? 3? 2? What would land someone a 1 or 0?
  13. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Charisma also affects Fundraising. I have no problem believing Trump would have an advantage here as well due to his charisma.
  14. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Have you watched his rallies? The crowds are huge (YUGE) for *mid-terms* and seem highly enthusiastic. For Barnstorming, personal charm is important, which again, he seems to have. He has a good sense of humor and a quick wit (see his Republican debates in particular). The concept of Charisma is defined in terms of how it operates in the game. Bonuses for Barnstorming, Rallies, Speeches, Interviews, Debates. Any game attribute is going to be an approximation to the real world. You're right that Sanders was drawing large crowds in 2016, but Sanders doesn't have high charm, what he has is perceived integrity and his message.
  15. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    But we are taking about campaign charisma and charisma at rallies, fundraising and large audiences. That is where charisma will mostly play a role. Sanders excels equally with Trump here. I think @admin_270 needs to clearly define charisma as he sees it, and hopefully elaborate on why Trump has high charisma and Sanders (and perhaps Clinton also) don’t. To me, Trump having high charisma must be something other than why Obama, FDR, JFK, BClinton or Reagan have high charisma. It was personal magnetism, charm, and mass appeal that brought a little envy from even the opposition. That is to say, the opponents wished they had a version of that politician at the time. You don’t see Democrats wanting a Democratic Trump really.
  16. admin_270

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    @vcczar Trump was a celebrity before becoming a politician. As Lizphairphreak notes, he has a strong personal charm. I have read various anecdotes that support this. However, he's a polarizing figure. Some people dislike him because he says things they really dislike, not because he's low charisma, IMHO. I start with the question, is he above average charisma? It seems yes. If so, in the old game system he would be a 4 or 5. Is he a 5? No, I don't think so. So, that means a 4. In the new game system, that means two options, 7 or 8.
  17. lizphairphreak

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    I don't agree with that definition of Charisma on my own subjective level, but I was thinking that even though many really dislike Trump, he really does have a weird charismatic aura around him. Katy Tur wrote a bit about it in her memoir of covering his campaign, how he was still really nice to her and oddly pleasant to be around even as he was calling her out by name at his rallies. He seems to have an ability to schmooze and "turn it on" a bit, which is something that I'd argue Sanders doesn't really have.
  18. Kingthero

    New Historical President RP

    @Reagan04 Does this mean you are officially deploying American troops abroad as volunteers to defend other countries from the Russo-Sino alliance?
  19. Kingthero

    New Historical President RP

    Austria became a Confederacy, and only was recently sort of reunited in terms of militaries because of the Russian threat. The Ottomans lost most of their possessions, and only kept modern day bulgaria, turkey, and iraq/kuwait by the time they got invaded. Both of the above, without the radicalization of policy due to major scale wars, were able to do reforms to, in general, keep themselves somewhat together. Russia, on the otherhand, is a pure example of the lack of checks and balances. Without having to focus on foreign affairs much at all, and with the increased technology they saw in this timeline, they were able to avoid any major scale revolution that would lead them to some form of demise.
  20. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Shouldn’t Bernie Sanders have a high charisma then? His supporters were fired up as much as Trump’s supporters. Many argue that he could have beat Trump. Trump won his nomination partially because he had more opponents splitting votes. Sanders didn’t have the luxury. @admin_270 gives Sanders low charisma, but by your definition, it should be very high.
  21. lizphairphreak

    Preferred 2020 Democratic Candidate

    1. Gillibrand 2.Booker 3. Harris 4. Warren 5. Castro 6. Clinton 7. Biden 8. Sanders 9. Avenatti .......... Trump
  22. Reagan04

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    I think we are defining Charisma differently, Charisma has generally been said to mean the ability to attract fiery supporters through oration and a marked ability to stir those supporters up. Trump undoubtedly has this. This isn't about breadth of support as much as it is depth of support.
  23. Patine

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree there, but I don't think Anthony will be moved by my dubiousness and reservations.
  24. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    I think it’s an improvement. I would have preferred a decimal system or even a 1-100, like they do for sports games.
  25. vcczar

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    How do you justify so high a charisma for Trump? He isn’t appealing to even some Republicans. Both candidates from 2016 lacked the charisma that makes the candidate seem attractive to members of the opposing party, even if they don’t vote for them. Trump seemed to repel as much as Clinton repelled. If he had higher charisma, he would have earned a 50% pop vote or even a 50% approval rating when he has a strong economy. I think it’s more than just low integrity. If the charisma is 4, then the integrity should probably be 0 or 1.
  26. Conservative Elector 2

    Preferred 2020 Democratic Candidate

    Trump Biden Booker H. Clinton Sanders Gillibrand K. Harris J. Castro Warren Avenatti
  27. Patine

    2020 Candidate Charisma

    Personally, I believe increasing the range of Charisma from 1-5 to 1-10, from a scenario designer point-of-view, and my own point-of-view, will make things more onerous, not an improvement or feature.
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